0:13 so this meeting is about Liberation Freedom now Liberation isn't isn't a thing it isn't something that can be known it it it actually is already everything is already liberated this is this is Liberation it's the most obvious thing that's happening it's it's absence it's the absence of knowing what's happening it's the emptiness that is everything already everything's empty there's
1:00 nothing in here there's just absence so it doesn't have a position there's not a position for absence there isn't even a here for absence it's just absence emptiness emptiness is Liberation and everything is already empty now this emptiness in emptiness or in Freedom might be easier to talk talk about it like that in freedom freedom can appear to be something and that something that we're pointing to or talking about is the the
1:45 sense that there's a someone a someone in the body looking out a someone having a feeling or knowing what this is now that sense of being someone engenders Eng well first off it hides the the absence that everything is already but it engenders a sense of need wanting and generally that sense of need or wanting is is um is not questioned it's just a part of life trying to find something a better experience whatever that might
2:33 be every sense of Separation has that sense of need and every sense of separation is seeking to fulfill that there there is sometimes a dissatisfaction or a recognition that that getting more more experience more knowing somehow isn't what's truly longed for and so you end up in a meeting like this the thing is is that in this meeting so that sense of Separation part of its conviction is that what what's truly
3:20 longed for if no if if if satisfaction is not not working anymore what's truly longed for is something else it's something in the future it's something that's going to happen to you to that separate sense that's going to bring about the end of seeking the absence and most well all paths confirm that sense of separation and that sense that something will happen in the future that something is going to happen to that sense of Separation which is going to bring about the end of seeking but this meeting isn't like
4:06 that what's obvious is that there is already absence even that sense of separation is absence appearing as a sense of Separation so that in this meeting there won't be any confirmation that there's an actual separate sense actual it's apparent I understand understand that but it's not real and there won't be any suggestion on what to do or where to go or how to find what's longed for and the reason there isn't is because what's obvious is that it is
4:52 already absence is all there is appearing as right now an apparent meeting a about absence for that sense that separate sense the idea is that there's something missing and for the separate sense the only thing that has value is experience and knowing so the separate sense will say that there's something well let's let's put it here there's something that this knows that that doesn't there's something that this has that that has do doesn't have there's something there's an experience that happened here that didn't happen there and counterintuitively it isn't that way this doesn't this this doesn't know
5:37 anything that that doesn't know it's nothing happened here that isn't already happening there that whatever that is all everybody is the same absence it's already done so in that sense there's really nothing on offer it isn't about getting anywhere there is something about or the possibility that that the that this message which isn't actually a message the absence being shared can be can be um can become obvious it's just being overlooked it's
6:25 overlooked by the separate sense that feels like knowing and experience are all that have value but that isn't what's truly longed for what's truly longed for is already what is absence being everything that appears nice to to be here so may I ask you a question about relationships I know there are no real relationships between people people but uh before this uh parent of Falling Away of me in in Jim yeah and now for example when I compare I have three children I have
7:13 relationships and I can be only myself like without any uh pretensions without any demands only with my daughter who is six months old because there are no there are no you know such kind of some requirement something some um yeah the difference we're talking about is the sense that someone there has something like children yeah and as long as there's that sense there'll be the sense of well of being a person and a a person is a mask yeah it'll it'll feel it'll have a mask
7:59 being someone in particular yeah and you wait something from other people yeah you you want something from you have expectations yes especially from children you want them to be successful to study well talking about expectation is a is a bit of a I don't know it could get a could get a little bit into the weeds because there's still you know even when there isn't anyone there's a reasonable expectation that even if my if the if the um headlights don't show the road at the end of the where the wherever I'm headed that there'll be a road there there's a reasonable expectation we're we're not talking about what appears we're talking about what that it the sense that there's
8:45 someone separate that it's appearing for is an illusion yeah but for example you still can have some expectations from from your surrounding from people you interact with yeah for for example to help you somewhat yeah it's some well there aren't any other people there's just what's happening I there's I the best I can get is there's a reasonable expectation that yeah you know the road will be there when you go around the corner that seems to be part of the functioning of this that there's a reasonable expectation but there isn't any expectation on on other people because there aren't any yeah but do you interact yeah with
9:31 people I can I don't so yeah but but there can be interaction friendly friendly interaction or unfriendly yes totally yeah all that can happen yeah but but so there is no one that can choose to be friendly or not friend part of the part of the the illusion or part of the story of separation is what you're describing is the value of the appearance the individual can't help but look for Value in the appearance yeah but we can still so not we but there can be some Choice made on on some again it's the value it's the
10:17 value of choosing or not choosing it's the value of being in control choice is the sense of having control over what's happening yeah no but I me all focused it's all focused on the appearance the appearance for that separate sense is real it matters it's it has a it has something it calls a life or it feels like it has something that of a life and it's trying to make it work what we interact so somehow interaction goes on on you're back to making the appearance have value which it doesn't not in that sense yeah part of part of the absence the the end of that dream which isn't already
11:02 which already isn't real is that what H what's happening has meaning it has purpose that it matters in that way yeah I can see I can see that there is no value but for example choosing a partner so it was made on level you're back to the value of what's happening and the choice that the individual dreams it makes no no value on on any level just no no value on any level no a parent choice there's a parent choice but no one ever makes it even even the separate sense doesn't make the choice you know it's a it's an interesting idea yeah I always
11:49 thought that this energy yes this contracted energy somehow yeah I don't know on what level but somehow can can affect the choice I don't know so this oh it does it does there's there's a completely different the the appearance is different seems different if there's an individual because it's looking for something so it does have an effect on it doesn't have any power yeah Power no power yeah but but it but as a reaction it has an effect yeah yeah I can see I can see so thanks and another question so I have I have been listening to one of your um meetings uh real meetings
12:35 yeah and about the problems of translation so you know I have noticed that the words apparently for example in the Russian language apparently have has two meanings apparently meaning without any doubt so I apparently see your idea yeah and apparently meaning it's an appearance apparently we are here apparently yeah and there were questions all the time that how what does it mean apparently if we are apparently here it means yeah and every time there was a problem yeah Lost in Translation as to say that apparently means just not uh without any doubt but apparently just an
13:21 appearance yeah that's right that's what I mean by it yeah apparently not not in the meaning without any doubt out no because yeah yeah so thanks a lot all right thank you Susan goodbye hi helloa hi Jim Hi how are you yeah good thanks how are you good so um this despite the uh knowledge the understanding that's all illusory most of us come here I didn't
14:07 there isn't in us there isn't in us there is this such understanding there isn't even a you of of course there reason but still there appears um despite understanding it's illusory become ill in it in the illusion of being identified with the story yeah it's not it's not about identifying or disidentifying but yeah the separate sense is looking for something overlooking the absence that it is that everything is already yeah as if feeling trapped and trying to get rid of it can feel all sorts of things it doesn't it doesn't really
14:52 matter being trapped and being not trapped are just stories are just are just the context it gives itself yeah and there's a lot of flourishing in this story and and not and a lot of apparent drama yeah yeah apparent trauma yeah it's so funny it's like uh in identifying with trauma it's like this about identification yeah we're not talking about identifying or disidentifying okay there isn't that it there isn't anyone yeah to identify or
15:41 disidentify but it appears to be that's why yeah trying to get rid of it yeah but that's the illusion yes trying to get rid of the illusion it's like a a mouse it is totally totally wow and it's what I trying to say it still it appears there is a split in trauma there is a split there is the not good enough and the other one trying to get rid of the not good enough there's more people more parent people in the C of Illusion when there's an individual there seems to be a multitude of things yeah and they all they're all important
16:27 because they're all Happ happening to me which is an illusion yeah well let's say it takes on an illusory importance but actually trying to get rid of it completely it's the same it's the same energy yeah it is it just confirms the sense of Separation yeah so hopeless Jim yeah yeah yeah yes thank you so much Jim thank you hello
17:14 sarth hi hi Jim um so so U this had been trying to find out what this is for some years but then I got your message and I understood that all the all the try all the trial of the attempts were trying to find a time to understand what this is was the actually the the contracted energy and I feel super light now and uh like so does the mind take some time to completely give up because like I feel super light because the thoughts that were used up by the contractor energy to you to I I to to the eye thoughts no I never gives up so it it it continues it doesn't not give up until it isn't anymore until it isn't anymore which
17:59 really is means it just never was there isn't there isn't an i to stop being I okay so so like so if whatever whatever the the thoughts that are necessary to thoughts that appear that are necessary to for the for this to work and to to function will come but whatever thoughts that were related to the the contracted energy that that was trying to understand something yeah that will be that will fade because that that stops yeah so so does it take because this happened to me like uh yesterday only and uh and and that is why I wanted to ask does this take some time to completely give up yeah
18:44 yeah okay uh and I just wanted some clarification that when you use the word apparently it it just means that it is happening in reality but it has no meaning to it it's just happening and that is why we can call it nothing yes but the the Apparently is making a distinction between the separate sense which sees the what is as real yes yes yes only to that extent this is separate separate and real this is this this is this is happening right but it's but it's only absence appearing yes yes true that yeah okay uh so I I just want the mind to completely give up and I just want your bus thank you so much who wants the mind to give
19:33 up thank you thank you I got I got you thanks thanks thank you bless me everything is already blessed hi Mark hello Jim hi um so would would you say that the me is is the need for change to always change something it doesn't matter it's just it's just a fundamental need it could be the need for things to say the same whatever whatever appears is in some sense dissatisfying because it's separate right so it will always need it just it just it just needs something
20:18 yeah that's the feeling that this as it is isn't complete right and when that need goes away there's no knowing of what the the character or there will will will do or maybe it will be more free or there is a freedom a an unfolding or a bloom blossoming in a sense of the separate um of the character but in in you know in the folks that I've seen where that's happened it isn't as it only only a couple of times has it been dramatically different than the way that you know than it was
21:08 before yeah okay well thanks thanks Mark hi AR hey Jen hi hi you doing enjoy summer Summer's great yeah fantastic fantastic starting to get a bit harder here is it very over there or how is it how was it over there there's news of a heat wave all over the us being in the mountains it doesn't get as hot yes yeah I can imagine yeah was quite nice I bet your brother I bet your brother's hot yes he is yes he they say that yeah but it's nice when we drove up
21:55 to the brayard area it was It was kind of there was a there was a a clear difference yeah yeah temperature yeah so enjoy have fun thanks uh so right now with listening to some of uh the speakers previously and to responses something that's emerged is so the sense of there being a Here and Now not saying that it belongs to anybody that that sense that's sort of like an object is being created so yeah it's a subject yeah yeah a subject yes subject as a which is an object that has an ownership no it's the creation of objects right no the subject isn't an
22:43 object the subject is the sense that there are objects the sense that there are objects okay so yeah which seems localized which gets an localization and then it things of itself as an object or it there is this this this apparent but that's the subject seeing seeing itself as an object yeah yeah that's exactly where I was coming to the subject sees itself as an object yeah and then there are objects everywhere there are objects there are concrete here and now things and that's where the whole differentiation and the sense of reality as something uh you know actually it's not it doesn't happen that way Arie it's
23:28 the sense of it's the sense it's the sense of being a subject that that at simultaneously is the sense that there's a reality yes it doesn't need another step of being objectified it's the it's the arising of the sense of Separation which is the sense that there's that what is is real and meaningful and purposeful MH so the moment there is a sense of subject there isn't a moment yeah okay the perception of the the subject arising is automatically separation that's right it is well the
24:16 the sense of Separation there isn't any yeah sense of Separation all there is is absence and that absence can appear as the sense of Separation but it's still absent it's still empty yeah so it's it's kind of paradox right so there's a an absence and it's trying to be a presence it's not trying to be anything it just can appear as that for without any reason but then it's like it can appear as a computer screen or a word yeah yeah yeah yeah just yeah it's just there appar only apparently apparent appar apparently it's just there as in felt
25:03 sense I uh but you were also saying that there is like the the the the knowledge of for example when you're turning around a corner there's continuation reasonable expectation yeah the reasonable expectations part yeah but that also requ doesn't that also require a subject doesn't that also require a seem to I mean there isn't a subject here it just seems to seems to be there the reasonable expectation that the road continues so that can that seems to be even in the absence of a subject oh totally
25:51 yeah the individual is looking for something to change in the appearance because it feels like that's where the solution is so it wants to it wants it wants to what would you call it oh I can't think of the word but differentiate in the appearance between what is and what isn't and it just has nothing to do with the appearance it has everything to do with the sense that someone sees someone sees so that's where that's the remate of what you were saying uh these reason reasonable expectations are yeah well well that but that's trying to differentiate the appearance what what is real and what isn't real and the appearance the individual that separate sense is looking for a
26:38 path I mentioned that in the beginning that it's that the sense of SE that separate sense feels like it's what it's longed for is somewhere else so it wants to find out how to find it and it can't it doesn't have anything else except the appearance to try to find it in and that entire story hides that all there is is absence which is what's longed for yeah the story of okay if there are reasonable expectations there can be unreasonable expectations we need to differentiate the whole the whole story of trying to find something yeah you make you're actually making a gumbo out of all and then trying to when you come that just arises okay
27:24 when you're all there is all there is is gumbo yeah it doesn't matter what's in there no it doesn't matter yeah just so funny as as well as it's as funny as it as it is hopeless hopeless and funny seem to go together totally yeah I think that's that's where the disconnect is if it's hopeless then it shouldn't be funny or if it's funny then yeah that's where yeah nice nice that sets me up for the summer thank you much thanks H take care enjoy the and have a great time bye
28:12 thanks bye hi arand how are we doing with connection now yeah now I'm fine can you hear me y okay now I'm fine so I I was saying you know about death you you told me something about yeah bodies die apparent okay apparently and but this changes when death let's say uh occurs yeah well it changes all the time apparently yeah but it it changes into nothing no no it doesn't it is
29:01 nothing oh yeah it is nothing uh apparently changing [Laughter] yeah yeah yeah because um I will tell you a personal story now about this experience I had with um ecstasy it is a drug uh I had the mystical mystical yeah okay okay but any experience is is is part of the separate dream definitely yeah and so what the individual will do with that is it will say that it has it has some value or meaning overlooking the absence of this
29:46 yeah really longed for yeah because I'm trying to find something there yeah of course yeah there is nothing to find there isn't anything lost that's actually something that uh seems to have been revealed when yeah when that happened yeah so a very brief description is like the body it just dissolved I don't know how to explain it that is just the inside and the outside was everything was so it's what like it was one thing let's say it is okay so I I couldn't differentiate from the inside and the outside even the
30:32 sound even the sounds like that's right where are they it just appears yeah yeah it's just but that's the way it is now yeah I mean crazy right and this profound sense of uh like this profound sense that it is all happening like I I was looking at the sky and the birds were flying but I did not see birds flying I just color shifting and it was so immediate you know at that yeah that's it it was obvious yeah yeah at that time you know
31:24 yeah yeah that's it I mean that's it that's that's nothing appearing yet there's just colors yeah forms and shapes and sounds happening nowhere yeah and in that and I remember this profound sense of I don't matter like it's not personal yeah it it was it's not that it's not that you don't matter it's that there isn't to you but that profound sense of uh let's say love yeah you know that was seems like it was everywhere you know yeah yeah well it is it's it's all there is and it is just what is
32:17 yeah that's mindblowing like I I still like uh I know what happened that you know that day but you know you don't The Knowing of what happened that day is how this being the exactly the same hides you can't know unconditional love you can't know absence wow yeah because there there's nothing there so there's nothing to be known so trying to know it it's like putting a
33:03 veil into it OB absolutely yeah that's exactly what happened yeah that seems so real when when you know yeah but it's so about death because that is when death comes from the question of death because I didn't feel like uh was life or death yeah well there isn't it's a it's part of the dream of Separation that there's death for the individual but there isn't an individual that's the only death that's feared is the death of the individual so the death of the
33:49 individual is feared you say yeah but that's just part of the dream yeah right it is yeah and this just appears to happen like there's no reason about no no that dream is absence as well a yeah it's a bird flying yeah I don't know it opens up something it's like describe yeah yeah it is yeah so thank you thanks
34:43 arand hey Ethan hi Jim hey can you hear me yeah good morning I I'm sure there's not really any worthwhile question to ask but I I still wanted to to say hi and do with you for minute oh sweet I do have some confusion that comes in around like time um a lot of times I hear what seems easy to understand intellectually is that it's just this and also part of what this is has a story about where I came from and where I'm going and but at the same time I hear a lot of speakers make these concessions to I'm being real like well
35:30 you know I used to go see Tony and then I read this book and then yeah and and it's like there's everyone's buying into that there was these things that happened in some sense but but that comes out of you as you say buying into that this is really happening any question that I start if I were to say Do you believe that X it's just like well there's no there's no one here right is that the answer well there's just no one to believe right okay belief is part of the part of the dream of separation makes it feel better so there's no one over there that has a
36:15 story about like I did a zoom call last week or something or I met one of these people before there might be a recognition when you see one of them in a sense of warmth but there's no well they're memories of all that more or less and and you Eng those memories occur as real they give you a context for this oh they don't occur as real nothing does this doesn't this isn't real H it's apparent it it seems to be happening but it doesn't have any reality beyond the seeming happening of it memories are just like that they're oh absolutely that's it okay so um I so time not being real seems easier to
37:01 to understand even though I know understanding isn't the game here what about people say like or not people this message I've been hearing like space is also not real you help me just like it's apparent space for the individual is I'm here and everything else is there that it has a position the individual has a position in relation to everything else that's that's the sense of but I I imagine what illusion there isn't an individual there isn't a position that like um Arin was talking about there isn't an inside or an outside of a body thoughts or birds or whatever sound doesn't happen anywhere it happens everywhere that's just that's just everything whatever appears is
37:48 everything so there's no no distance space or time to it although there might appear to be so my mind wants to say well when you go give a talk in unic there's like a little it doesn't work does it now you're trying to talk about a story that there's someone going somewhere doing something there's apparent movement but it's absence apparently moving just like talking or anything else happens there isn't someone there isn't someone in that happening to which it's happening too there's Just Happening in the sense of location like my sensory apparatus are limited to what happens in this room there's a sense of being at a
38:34 point in location but that sense of location for the body is seems to have a a solidity a reality to it when there's someone having that when there isn't any what happens where your body is it's just what's happening it's just what happens there's just what appears and when your body goes into a different room is there a sense location in a sense nothing happened because it's all absence but there the appearance the appearance seems to have changed to another room and it isn't anyone's body no one has a body there isn't anyone right there's a sense of that
39:20 like at some point suppose you were to die then this message won't come through this way anymore change things apparently change all the time but that's absence apping to change appearing to change and stories about a future in which something happens it's just absence appearing as stories it's also absence appearing as though this is real or that it has a center or position to it it's still absent was fun to fun to meet you thank you all right thanks man okay see
40:07 L hi John hi John hey Jim how you doing yeah good thanks how are you good um I was wondering if uh um appearance could be called Consciousness I think it's misleading I I was at a I had a residential a couple of well maybe months now ago and there was a an Indian man who wanted to talk about Consciousness and I said well okay what do you mean by Consciousness he says well nothing I said well why not just say nothing right because it seems to me that it's misleading for me that if someone were to say awareness or Consciousness that would be something I could
40:54 do it would it would be it it impli someone doing something or being conscious or being aware nothing nothing doesn't have or absence doesn't have that implication I think it's clearer yeah I think you're right I'm also wondering if this communication or what you're saying could be called a philosophy yeah I think for a lot of people it is a philosophy that's not what's being communicated there as far as I'm concerned there isn't even a message it's not really trying to impart any sort of information or philosophy it's pointing to what can't be known which isn't separate which is already so it couldn't it's not in that sense it's not in any way a philosophy
41:40 but it also sort of destroys all philosophies in it well I don't know if that's true because philosophy is just a description of um the appearance a lot of times but if you're talking about philosophies about the meaning of life the purpose of life life the meaning of the individual then yeah it does undermine it can undermine that it also undermines sort of metaphysical philosophies about how reality might be made up or oh totally oh it destroys the whole spiritual idea yeah completely yeah that it does yeah yeah okay thank you but it doesn't replace it with anything well but it's it sort of does though because it it's sort of the suggest well only if it's
42:25 misunderstood because it isn't doesn't replace it with anything the message is absence that is a mind a mind [ __ ] yeah okay thanks thank you yeah hey Mark hey hey Jim hey [Music] um so uh here I guess at least it seems to spend a lot of time sometimes on I maybe like if I'm talking to someone or like I will sort of project maybe I guess stories or yeah this this won't have anything to say to any of
43:13 that you're starting off with the sense the sense that there's an eye doing something and the very simple suggestion here is there isn't right okay but no I I can't help but try to figure that out in some way no that's true I understand that fair enough because it doesn't make any sense you know no just no but it's it's also just absence trying to figure it out it doesn't have any value to it it's just what's
43:59 happening apparent right right okay thanks thanks Mark hi Kathy hi Jim hey hi how are you good to see you good thanks you and missed the uh s of the uh phas well I know darn there was this big hole in the room where cath sitting nobody was question we left the chair empty for you oh sure okay anyway um when you were
44:45 talking before to a reef and somebody else like you know you you're going around the driving down the road and even without the subject you expect the road to continue well no one expects the road to continue but there is a reasonable expectation that the road continued because if if there was a reasonable uh expectation that the road did not continue that would be projection well correct yeah it just wouldn't fit it wouldn't make any sense to be on the road would it well it would be like a projection of the reality of this illusion I'm I'm a little lost where you're going with this but you know the
45:30 the appear in the appearance this body has has let's say experience it has a m and there's a reasonable expectation that that functions and this this is never driven on roads that weren't [Laughter] there okay it's like okay let me let me do this like let's say Kathy's physical form I'm I'm looking out the window and I'm seeing there is a Kathy's physical form okay the physical form died right now had a heart attack is the squirrel still there the individual wants to know everything it's a sense of control it's
46:18 a sense of wanting to be in control because you know there's it feels like the answer is in whether the squirrel is there or not it's it's tied to the sense that the individual the reason death is so fearful is because it's the loss of everything all fear comes from the fear of death and it's a sense all fear is the lot fear of loss that can be the loss of self value self-image possessions and all loss is the is death that's the sense of all loss and so wanting to know what happen Happ s after you die is the ultimate wanting to
47:04 control no no no no no no it was it was really um because I I came across somebody's Theory you know and you've heard this everybody's heard this that and I know you you know it's up enough well it's all projection this this this it's all projection of what the projection of of the awareness I don't know a projection it's just projection it's it's it's well as far as I'm concerned the only projection is out of the individual out of the separate SS the only projection is the separation
47:51 yeah and that projection or that that sense is that everything is real has meaning and purpose yeah yeah there there's nothing you more to be said like how it how it you know what I'm saying well it doesn't it doesn't doesn't it's simpler than it's simpler than figuring it out this is the beginning and end of everything this is everything it's so simple I know and so the me that separates goes what about [Laughter] me I can't figure that out no there's nothing to figure out yeah yeah yeah yeah just to be okay
48:41 trying to like get a hold of something oh totally yeah yeah yeah that's a teeny little pie give it to me Jim give it to me love you Jim thank you so much love you too thanks Kathy hi Allan hi can you hear me okay yeah cool um you know when I first uh found you uh on YouTube I was just so tickled that I seem to get hit every 20 years with some kind of a uh an
49:27 expansive uh period of time where new ideas arrive um I kind of everything fell apart in like the early 80s which began kind of a searching period yeah and uh like 20 years after that I often had a feeling that a lot of the things I was reading and listening to that uh some of the teachers or the people that that I was reading from uh just didn't go far enough if if they would have just taken it like all the way maybe I just had a feeling like that yeah that's just a story yeah uh when I read uh I found Wei W wayi the author yeah who was an old British
50:14 guy I thought he was a Chinese guy yeah but he he he spoke about um things like the absence of presence and absence yeah kind of like a double abs yeah and not a double absence it's just complete absence complete absence I guess right right because a lot of what the uh uh speakers were talking about was absence but that uh and then somebody would come along and have a story about how they experienced absence yeah they're not going far enough with it it seemed to me you know and and way way was a kind of a shot the arm in that way kind of a a way I he he also
51:03 uh well there were some other terms he use that really uh went further than anybody I'd heard up until that point and here we are in the uh 2020s and I I find you and I find Tony and I'm just tickled uh uh that that you know that that there's finally somebody out there who's not pulling any punches totally and laying it on the line yeah it's wonderful yeah yeah yeah just wonderful to spend time with you it's it's awesome you thank you all right thanks Alan you bet hi
51:49 Anita hi Jim hi I recognize that from the birds and the clouds and the sounds and the the movements of the branches what he was talking about was there isn't anyone to recognize it yeah you know it it touches yeah sometimes just steal this I don't want this so a kind of behavior but that's it but that's it as well I mean it's not it's not about finding anything or
52:35 changing anything that's emptiness I don't want this is empty there isn't actually a story to it it's just emptiness appearing is I don't want this thanks thanks a lot thanks hi Arlen hey Jim hey it's me again yeah I noticed so I was just reflecting a little bit more about the fact that when I speak to you because um I don't know if you remember but I I have spoken to
53:22 you many other other times it's always you always leave like it's always like not a big deal and it's always like it leaves you with nothing yeah when when you talk with other speakers that say that they are talking about the same stuff you know there's always something there to know yeah and it's something important you know yeah yeah yeah so they they say that we talking about nothing but they want to communicate something yeah so yeah this is very very it does matter
54:08 though no one does that it's just it's just absence appearing as appearing yeah yeah great thanks Arlin yeah yeah thank you hi Maran okay Jim um m is what memories memories yeah it's only what happens yeah absence appearing as memory
54:58 it's than cute okay yeah
55:55 how you feel hey Jim hey so sitting here like wanting to talk with you some more and knowing there's like no point to any question um and one thing I noticed I'm curious about is like there's there's this kindness and warmth that seems to be in the connection and the communications with the people that are talking to you or the whatever you know I'll just talk about it in the way it appears to me and and I'm i' I've tend to think of that as coming from someone like kindness and warmth are characteristics of a of a person who cares about nothing actually comes from anyone it's just a story that's a story there's just the appearance of kindness
56:42 and warmth are there other things that might show up I might come and be in a meeting anything there are absolutely no um guide rails guard rails to this it's immediate Wild free absolute you you could do something really severe like tell me to go [ __ ] off or like you could be other
57:27 than oh yeah yeah well yeah that seems to happen there's no question that has any value in this moment pass but nothing does right nothing nothing has any value it doesn't the whole idea of value is that the appearance is going somewhere it needs to go somewhere there's that there's a real this is really happening and it needs to become something that it doesn't and it isn't yeah there's a sense of wanting to justify why am I here by coming up with a good question or something yeah
58:15 yeah and that doesn't and that's the same the same absence appearing as a question or appearing as a sense that something has has to happen that somehow this isn't perfect I find the right question this could get even better right but if there aren't any guard rails what could what could the right question be what's excluded so so I listened to talk so I wouldn't hear you say to some people that's a really good question like in response to certain questions they aren they aren't special they aren't different oh do I say that sometimes that's a good question huh
59:00 yeah no no no I'm asking you I'm not saying you do I'm just asking sounds like oh right I don't know I would have I would have if had you said I did I would have thought oh right okay interesting the communication the communication that's happening here the questions aren't negligible it's not that they are completely unimportant but it's really the communication is absence so it's not the words themselves necessarily it's it's what's where the words are coming from so as emptiness kind of just talks
59:45 with itself is there any motive anywhere that wants anything to shift or anything to be known or not known no it's just the sound of the wind and the leaves absolutely there just isn't that need I keep noticing this desire to wonder about your experience like are you enjoying yourself but you would say like I'm not having an experience or there's no one having an experience that's right and and it's not different in a very real way from that it's just there might be an added an added sense there that there is an experiencer to this my part of this situation over here right and I'm so curious about your part over there as I hold on to my part here yeah it's the same it's the same it's
1:00:31 just there might be something there going this is my experience it's pretty sticky all that way of thinking and really the me is totally sticky yeah like every moment of Stillness gets followed by like trying to do something with it yeah oh this isn't about Stillness though it isn't about anything or it's about everything even that sticky meanness oh well that's the thing yeah the the the biggest conundrum for the individual is
1:01:16 that what's longed for is what it is there isn't actually a separation it's all already absent it's so it's so ironic the apparent context of these meetings and and you know it's like that there's something to get right get there like hey there's nothing to get be okay so what do I get about that right like immediately that's right how do I get that that there's nothing to get it's the only move I know it's like [Music] literally it is the only move the individual knows is what do I do about that what about me and sometimes when I'm listening other people interact with this message I get I can get irritated with them and say you're not listening you don't hear
1:02:01 it you know yeah and I but it's I'm I'm so wet anyway yeah so what yeah all there is is getting irritated who cares that's just irritation why not cool thanks man thank you hi Claire hi hi J hi um I just wanted to check with you I think you might have said um one of the meetings um that it's not that there isn't a
1:02:48 path it just it didn't happen in the past may I don't think that was quite the word you said but yeah it it's not that there isn't the past it just it just didn't happen in a timeline of that that's right well well that timeline is just an appearance of absence or nothing yeah yeah so it's not that there isn't what see what we put in the past apparently it's just not real it's it's just but it's still apparently yeah yeah oh this body is conditioned it learned English it has preferences all that still appears it just doesn't
1:03:35 happen the the illusion is that it happens for someone delusion is that it happens for someone or happened in the past for someone well for but for the individual the past is real rather than just the absence appearing as a past yeah well but the past could could happen for No One apparently happen well everything happens for no one already this is happening for no one yeah yeah yeah
1:04:29 okay thanks thanks Claire hi Mark hey um I think I forgot my question but maybe John can go first and I'll I'll okay all right yep I'll leave your hand up hi John hey um so we were just talking about I wonder if you're familiar with George Barkley the philosopher I am not so he said something very similar to you that basically there was no such thing
1:05:15 as matter matter was all immaterial because they were just ideas in the mind or something like that and no that's not that's not actually similar well it's sort of similar that he said that reality is in insubstantial that there's no actual material but it sounds like he has a philosophy that it's all a projection like Kathy was going to of the brain maybe I'm not sure what he would say about that but let's but putting that difference aside for a moment um he was he was someone argued against Samuel Johnson argued against him famously by saying that uh he kicked a rock and he said I refute it thus yeah but that's the problem with his argument I know that I know that discussion actually I remember that yeah people say that about this as well that if um oh
1:06:03 there's no one there let me punch you in the face and they'll you'll feel pain missing the entire point that it's not about whether pain appears or not it's just that it's it's happening for no one it's happening for no one yeah it's still okay I'm not sure I get that it seems like if it if it's if there's nothing yeah then shouldn't be any solidity anywhere there isn't well but then how come like this hand can't pass through this hand oh that's well there's a parent solidity but when you say a parent you mean that that solidity could go away let's say this P maybe this hand could pass through this hand Anything Could Happen doesn't seem to but
1:06:50 anything so then it's almost like nothing is in a kind of habit of appearing like like you said the road the no it's I wouldn't call it a habit no not in any way whatsoever there isn't any time there's apparent time but it's not real habit would require there to be time but it seems that the whole reality then sort of conceals what's being said because but you're talking about a reality as though it's real and part of a Continuum rather than an appearance of absence which is this but it seems to be you can't you can't put a you can't make sense of a story with what we're talking about here that's why it's not a philosophy that's
1:07:35 why it lead with nothing there isn't anywhere to go with it okay that's funny it has no value has no meaning or purpose no intention but yeah at the same time it's everything it's longed for oh yeah absolutely it's everything that's longed for but not what but not by that separate sense that separate sense wants to know this is absence and that's how absence hides it does seem like a bit of a cruel joke oh yeah a bit except there isn't anyone if there were really someone it would be cruel but there isn't [Laughter]
1:08:23 anyone okay thank you thank you hi Mark hey um well it seems like the me or whatever you want to call it is isy is living in a world of its own ideas of good and bad and how to live and how not to live or yeah oh totally and he just s spins around that all totally yep it's like talking not talking to itself but you know what I mean like completely oh it is it's talking to itself it's exactly what it's doing yeah and you're saying that is uh yeah what are what are you saying about that
1:09:10 well it comes with the sense of Separation that there's this these um this conversation with itself about right and wrong and good and bad and intention as it it is as there is someone in that that's the sense the sense is there's someone having a conversation with itself thinking is is mostly conversations with the the me having a conversation with itself not all of it but a lot of it and is that an issue to it or what what are you suggesting or well there is the the
1:09:56 biggest problem for the separate sense is there isn't a problem it's trying to solve something that isn't that isn't wrong okay right all there is is absence and that's what's longed for this conversation and everything else that seems to be appearing is absent is empty right it feels like there I mean I think I feel in my I was say contraction in my legs when I'm I don't know talking to you or it's like it's like it's like my body does like I don't know it feels
1:10:42 like yeah contract contracted or yeah fight or flight yeah kind of kind of uh yeah like just just T like just my legs are tensing tensing upward yeah but I know I'm not a it's not like I'm in danger but it's oh you are yeah but but but not like I'm in like I'm in the car going towards no it's worse than that in the car you might have a car wreck here you just might die [Laughter] right and and all the the stories of
1:11:29 whatever stories are just irrelevant or meaningless yeah there isn't anything actually relevant in the sense that it's all already absent there isn't any need for anything to happen things apparently happen but there isn't any need right okay okay thank you all right thanks smart hey
1:12:18 Allan uh that's funny uh I always suspected that people around you were dropping like flies you know that you're a very very deadly and dangerous guy so that that was pretty cool um to talk like that I I I imagine that you've had people uh that um have kind of come to the a final shift uh over the years uh yeah that have spent time with you yeah well I I mean they I've had I think most probably don't get into touch because why would you but I sometimes get telephone calls or emails that say that it wasn't about spending time it
1:13:04 was just they heard they watched a video right yeah I guess it doesn't take much uh depending you know I mean it's a bit misleading to talk about it actually there being a shift or something happening I think I've made clear through this through this meeting that it's already done all there is is absence so a shift in that sense is the same as a leaf falling or a burp or anything else it's just something that apparently happens it's not worth talking about only for the individual that feels like it's important and special that it's looking for something important and special to happen but the Liberation isn't important or
1:13:53 special right doesn't actually happen there isn't anyone for it to happen too exactly right yeah um pure subjectivity without an object yeah maybe yeah thank you Jim all right thanks Alan yeah
1:14:46 hi Giovani nope that didn't work let's see yeah okay when you say when we say that all there is is appearances the underlying uh emphasis is that nothing has more importance than anything other there is no meaning to anything right that's right but that's pointing to the absence of everything the absence of meaning the absence of purpose the absence of intention yes what I mean is that by saying that
1:15:32 it's all absence the relevance is that there is no meaning to anything that's right yeah that's [Laughter] cool no meaning to anything yeah it's just just appearences it's just freedom yeah I guess this is all I had to say great well thanks for that appreciate it
1:16:27 hi Mark oh hey when so is is the Sort Of You' say Liberation or Freedom or whatever is the more energetic then it feels like for or here this sort of contraction or tin tining tining tightening of the body when that kind of let say looses up or just well it's not about that loosening up it does hide the what comes out of the tension and it's not actually a physical tension that's recognizable as far as I'm concerned but what comes out of that tension is a sense of Separation a sense of being someone and that sense of being
1:17:12 someone hides that all there is is absence right but it's still all there is AB yeah I guess it it it makes I didn't hear any of that you're breaking up a bit it's a very okay it's a very [Music] um it's a very strong illusion then or it feels it feels strong it it feels that way when it's happening it feels like it's strong it's not really [Music]
1:17:57 it's part of the illusion yeah it's a good illusion [Laughter] then well it's not good or bad it's just how it appears I mean good as in strong or yeah I don't know yeah okay thank you yeah thanks Mark hi Nina hi Jim how are you hi good thanks how are you yeah nice to see you again uh my question is because I sense I don't know there is a sense that when
1:18:45 everything is empty you know like appears it's appears but it's empty in itself something like that that's right yeah so that's mean there is doesn't leave any Trace no okay so being empty there is like there is no past no future kind of well there's an apparent past and apparent yeah but because it's empty yeah it's all fresh and new yeah it's all fresh and new that's yeah that's what I I'm like how do I see that but because it feels not feel you know that sense of wow yeah so every time is New because it's and
1:19:32 doesn't have a trace doesn't so that's the freedom that is freedom yeah it is freedom because I don't have like but it's but I mean that's this is already free whether there's a sense of a trace or not yeah okay it's all already free but it gives kind of a like that part of that freedom is that it can appear as limited as a trace as a trace but it's not Trace it's no there isn't no okay thank you all right thanks Nina yeah I just want to say that that in Tennesse that retreat was I mean residential was beautiful I really yeah it was lovely it was lovely
1:20:18 I love that place so see you next year okay great for now all right um hi Kathy hi hi I can't find the video oh anyway hi I just wanted to just want to say I want to be one of those people that sends you the email a no one sends email just emails happen apparently I put the email to happen that's all you don't actually love you Jim
1:21:05 thank you thank you so much thanks than you oops didn't mean to cut you off hi Moira hi hey can you hear me yeah can you hear me oh you disappeared again oh God there we are can yeah there we go I'll leave the video off because I can't get it on okay I got annoyed about something or I've latched on to something that someone said a minute ago because I was all right I was sailing along and then um I didn't who it was a couple of speakers back said um as he was
1:21:53 going there's subjectivity without an object yeah and that I've latched on to that go what's that supposed to mean I'm like yeah just that I mean it's meaning really because there can't be a subject without an object but I understood what he meant that's what I'm thinking yeah well it's meaning well done you picked it up I picked it up I did pick it up yeah I led on to it like a yeah you know a limpa ah so there's nothing there's there's no there is no subject either the subject is well there's nothing identifiable there's absence emptiness nothing yeah but if there's a subject that is an object no oh totally
1:22:38 yeah right yeah yeah okay I feel better now then okay oh good yeah okay that's all all right thanks yeah okay I got now but see what all right Giovani we're gonna stop after this hi Giovani uh if we talk about pure subjectivity isn't it the same as saying as pure objectivity yeah they are both the same right yeah because there is no separation that's right okay thank you yeah yeah thank you thanks folks I will I I will say in
1:23:26 in parting I guess sort of what I said in the beginning is there isn't this isn't about anything really it's there it's not offering any path or any goal or anything to take away whatsoever everything what's longed for is absence all there is is absence and that's already the case this is that it's all that apparently happens is nothing or absence thank you all thank you all very much for joining bye
