Martin Armstrong: Why The World Order Will Collapse in 2032 | Gold, Oil & The US Dollar

0:00 They've wiped out their pension funds. This is why they need war. Rand is playing 3D chess and we're playing [music] checkers. What our computer showing is that uh 2032 will be more or less the collapse [music] in Republican forms of government. I'd expect gold to go up to at least set the 7,000 to 8,000 level um with a shot of even reaching up to uh 11,000 by 2032. >> Martin Armstrong, renowned trend forecaster and founder of Armstrong Economics. It is a true pleasure to host you on Palisades Gold Radio today. >> Well, thank you for inviting me. Interesting times we live in, right?

0:47 >> For sure. Interesting times. And the last time we had you on the podcast was early March of this year, just a few days after the Iran war originally kicked off, also an interesting time. And while other analysts were still drawing parallels between Iran and Venezuela, you already foraw this would be a long tracked out affair. Unfortunately, history has proven you to be correct. So I'll be very curious to hear what do you make of this conflict today? Looking back at it, how consequential will future historians find this iteration of war in the Middle East? And assuming another round of peace talks are on the table between Trump and Iran, where will this take us? >> Um, [clears throat] actually

1:34 Trump was suckered into this. Um they brought Netanyahu into the situation room. No other foreign leader has ever entered that room. Uh and they sold it that it's um it would be in and out quickly like Venezuela. Uh Netanyahu's strategy is always to assassinate the head of state and if it's Hamas or Hezbollah or whatever and he assumes that you do that and the country or organization will

2:21 collapse. Uh he's been doing this for decades and he has not won even one time. um in 2025 he targeted um a bunch of their military leaders. So Iran [clears throat] um is not Venezuela. Iran is one of the most highly educated countries um around [clears throat] and they reorganized their government. And [clears throat] if you listen to some of

3:07 the comments of Rubio, he says we're now, you know, negotiating with the third tier. What they did was they set up um they divided the the government into four tiers initially so that if he they knew he would try to take out the Ayatollah. So the [clears throat] others are already set in place and so you take out the head of state it doesn't matter. Uh they all have their orders. the next one just steps up and so on. I can tell you since you know we have offices everywhere. U

3:53 I can tell you that Taiwan is now adopting the um Iran model so that if you take out the the leadership it doesn't stop. All right. Um [clears throat] the other aspect of this is that uh you have these neocons who have [clears throat] used Netanyahu to get into Trump. I know some of these people. I mean they do not think strategically. They cannot see anything beyond the end of their nose. Um, and just listen to uh, [clears throat]

4:39 you know, Tony Blair's apology. It's on YouTube. And he apologizes for the Iraq war. He said, [clears throat] "We thought we were saving the people," which was the Neilan, you know, mantra. Uh, he said, "We didn't realize we were subjecting them to sectarian violence. um Sodom Hussein, yes, an authoritator, you know, authoritative dictator in a way, but that's what you needed. He kept all the different groups from fighting and killing each other. All right. Um and this is what they don't understand. You had Dick Cheney saying, "Oh, no.

5:24 This will just be a matter of weeks." There is never a plan B for what happens. Okay. Um they took out S Saddam Hussein. Fine. They had no idea it would then lead to ISIS etc. All right. And this is the same problem. Um you know [clears throat] I I did a a conference in Canada. Uh I spoken in Calgary and then in Vancouver and I stood up and I said you know [clears throat] very plainly I wouldn't I would have secured the straight of her moves before

6:09 the first bomb fell. Why? I can tell you that every [clears throat] war game that I was aware of for at least the the last, you know, going on even up to 10 years, Iran would naturally go after the Hormuse straight and shut it down. You know, [clears throat] all I can say is that these people are idiots. They got Trump to go in on this nonsense and now he can't get out. All right. From Iran's perspective, they want a guarantee. They will not be

6:56 invaded again. Trump cannot deliver that because he cannot control Netanyahu. So it um this is why you know look Iran [clears throat] has built one of the largest arsenals of ballistic vessels. They have been planning for this war for a decade. Um so the idea that you could just go in and take out the Ayatollah and it's all over with. You're out of your mind. Um, I don't know what to say other than these people that promoted this were complete idiots.

7:43 Um, look, I have, you know, staff and offices in Dubai. They sent Iran sent more missiles and drones at Dubai than they did Israel. Why? Today's episode of Palisades Gold Radio is proudly brought to you by our parent company Palisades Gold Corp. Canada's leading junior resource investment vehicle trading on the Toronto Venture Exchange under ticker symbol P AI with equity and warrant positions in over 200 companies. Ownership of mineral projects and royalties and a significant stake in Newfound Gold. Bellisades offers investors powerful leveraged exposure to precious metals, uranium, copper, and other critical minerals. Bellisade

8:29 shareholders directly benefit from our team's extensive industry knowledge and access to deal flow opportunities historically reserved for a small group of investors. To learn more, visit us at pelisad.ca and join us in our mission to level the playing field for investors. Now back to the show >> because after Switzerland started freezing any Russian money said, "Oh, you knew Putin." So you say, "Okay, fine. There's 300 billion that they have frozen." The bulk of that is private assets. If you really pick up the rug and look, you'll see yachts and and houses and stuff. This is not Russian government money. Once they did that,

9:18 um, [clears throat] all the rest of the money left, I mean, it went to Dubai, uh, and Singapore, I can tell you. I mean, we have actual offices there, and I got staff there, and everybody's in town. Um, they built a $30 billion AI facility there. Um, Iran [clears throat] attacked it. They took it offline for about a week. The banking system went down. We couldn't even send money to our staff there. All right. So, I Iran is playing 3D chess and we're playing checkers.

10:03 Um [clears throat] to them, you know, um this is a war against the great Satan and little Satan. This is the way they see it. Okay. Um mostly stems from the fact that the CIA did overthrow their government and stole the shaw. And so from their perspective, the US has always been this great Satan, so to speak. Um, and the Islamic government pulled a very

10:49 standard, you know, how to overthrow a government 101. uh basically uh when seizing the American embassy was strategic because they were able to use that that within Iran you naturally any government you have you know left and right. Okay. Um so anybody that stood up to criticize the new religious government um they immediately said you are a supporter of Israel and the great Satan. So you you don't address the issue

11:35 of religion or something like that. Europe is doing this also. [clears throat] Anybody that supports or criticizes Zinsky, oh, you're a Putin supporter, they don't address the issue. It's a distraction. All right. Um, oh, look at the bird over there, you know. Uh, and [clears throat] so, I mean, that's what Iran did. So, all this stuff, oh, death to America, death to, you know, [clears throat] they didn't launch any actual threat against the United States. Uh but it is more of a propaganda thing to keep control. All right. So [clears throat] um when you're dealing with ideological

12:24 issues, there is no real solution to this. The same thing with Ukraine. Um [clears throat] we have staff in Ukraine, in Kiev, and in Donesp. um [clears throat] they wouldn't even talk to each other. You know, you went to school in Kiev and you were brainwashed that it was Russia that stole all the food and 7 million died. And I've tried to talk to them, but you can't. Um I said, you know, Stalin was from Georgia. He wasn't Russian. Okay. The guy Kanovich who was in charge of taking all the food was a a Jew who was born in Kiev

13:09 and the whole thing was he was getting back at the at the Ukrainians because they killed all the Jews. All right. So is a you know um so it wasn't a Russian involved. Um but you know they just hate Russians and because that's what they were taught in school. Um, so you're not going to change that. The same thing in the Balkans when they when Yugoslavia broke up. Um, I was called into the government before it fell and they were, you know, like, "Oh, you don't know. They they killed 600 of us and threw us in a common grave." And I thought, "Oh [clears throat] some, you

13:55 know, I must have missed it on the news or something." I said, 'When did this happen? I said, 'Oh, about 700 years ago. I said, 'Oh, okay, that one. You know, um [clears throat] the whole Balkan area, even Bismar before World War I, he said Europe is going to be engulfed in a major war and it's going to come from the Balkans. the the hatred is just systemic because that area was you've got three religions overlapping. You've got Western [clears throat] Christianity, Orthodox Christianity. Uh the Turks had conquered it. So you got Muslims in there. Um and they all hate each other. All right. When Yugoslavia broke up, it

14:42 broke up according to ethnic lines, you know. So we [clears throat] have to understand this whole region including the Middle East. These are biases, prejudices, whatever you want to call it. But it's [clears throat] not like, you know, u we're playing Monopoly, I'll give you boardwalk for a park place, you know. Uh it's not a territorial uh issue per se. It's more of I hate your guts sort of thing. You know, when you get religion in there, it's I just don't see any solution to this. It's

15:27 always going to be there. um you might get a you know a a temporary you know suspension uh a peace agreement where they just are rearming themselves. Um but you know this idea that everybody was saying oh you know it'll be over with in a day. It's just nonsense. Um you have to understand the regions. you know, we've got offices all over the I mean, I've been to the Middle East. Um, I understand these things. Uh, and I think it sometimes it it just takes boots on the ground to really understand what is developing. Uh, and

16:14 you know, I understand the history fine, but you know, I don't think I could negotiate a a lasting peace. um maybe a temporary ceasefire or something like that, but I just don't see it. Um in the Middle East, you have um the reason Iran has been against the Gulf States. Um Iran, they're Persians, they're not Arabs, they're Caucasian. Um, I've met many from there and they sometimes they even look like they're Irish, redhaired, you know. Um, they're

17:02 not Arab. Um, and that's why there's always been this tension between the Gulf States and Iran. And then Iran um [clears throat] they tend to follow uh the Shia they they tend to follow Muhammad's brother-in-law. Okay. So even Islam is split. Uh so you have [clears throat] um you can go to Turkey and you'll see a girl in a bikini on page three. You know, you go to Iran and she's in a burger, you know. Um, [clears throat] Saudi Arabia has a king. Iran finds that offensive.

17:49 Okay? That the church should rule. So, the Ayatollah should rule, not a um an elected republican type government or or monarchy or something of that nature. Uh so it's at that very fundamental level that's what Shia is. It's a um a different sect of of Islam. Uh and then you have the problem that there are many Shia that are in all the [snorts] other Gulf states including Egypt. Um, so my concern has been taking out the Ayatollah

18:35 turns it into a religious war. Um, and we tend to throw everybody in the same boat. Um, I know some um, Iranians here in in the United States born in the United States. They're westernized, not terrorist or something like that. But the way Iran [clears throat] was treated in the World Cup offends them because we tend to throw, oh, you're Iranian. They throw them in with the Ayatollah. Oh, it's all Iranians. And it's not. Um, just like you have people that voted

19:21 Democrat and others voted Republican. I mean, there's always two sides in no matter what country you ever go to. But, you know, just like 911 when that happened, you saw uh the Democrats and Republicans come together. That's what's happening in Iran. all this attacking and I'm gonna bomb you into stone age and stuff like this is the Iranian people you're talking about now not just simply the Ayatollah and unfortunately there's no evidence whatsoever uh [clears throat] for hundreds of year

20:07 you're not going to be able to uh overthrow the regime in Iran. man, no matter how much bombing he wants to do. All right, it would take boots in the ground. >> With gold trading at new all-time highs, gold producers are printing money. And this means that for the first time in years, money is beginning to flow into expiration. This is a trend that we at Palisades Gold Corp have long anticipated, which is why we spent the last decade assembling the largest junior held mineral claim package in the United States through our subsidiary, Made in America Gold Corp. Made in America Gold Corp. holds over 700 km of prospective ground. Located exclusively within America's most prolific gold mining trend, the Battle Mountain Eureka trend made in America's properties are

20:53 nestled amongst several of Nevada's largest gold mines and resources, making it higher perspective for a potential discovery. To find out more, visit pelisades.ca and join us on our mission to make Nevada's next multi-million gold discovery. Now, back to the show. Martin, is that exactly what is at risk? Boots on the ground in this conflict as well as potentially a broadening out of the war with the Ukraine war that you outlined earlier. Of course, we've seen a strike from Ukraine on a Iranian tanker in this Caspian Sea just a few days ago. >> Zalinski is really a war criminal. Um he's del, you

21:38 know, he is one of these um he's really a neo-Nazi. I have tapes of him before he was president standing on stage mo making jokes about confiscating assets from Russians and Jews. He's like Soros. He married a Christian girl. His children are baptized. All right. only after he became president to hide the fact that he was a neo-Nazi. Um, oh, I'm Jewish. I mean, I have friends in Israel and they basically have said he's no Jew, you know. Um, so he he's deliberately

22:26 trying to take out um the energy facilities in Russia. he could care less about anybody else. You know, you had Trump once the straight to Harm Moose was shut down, Trump lifted some of the sanctions to try and help the world. Zillinsky said, "Screw you. I'm doing it my way." All right. So here you have I mean he's you know it's been confirmed he took out the pipeline from Russia to to Germany and screwed the entire European continent. Um if you look at the GDP growth of Germany it's down to 0.8%.

23:12 Um they've lost Volkswagen. I mean you name it. I mean it's he has destroyed the European economy. Why anybody gives this guy a dime is beyond me. But um [clears throat] so he is deliberately going after major assets inside Russia hoping to provoke uh Putin into attacking anything in NATO. He's attacked um the Iranian ships uh and he's sought to basically try to merge the two wars. Uh he's you know going to Washington hand you know [snorts]

23:58 uh pleading for more Patriot missiles. You know [clears throat] the the the very simple thing was it was a mint agreement. The don boss they are Russians. Okay. You know I had people in Donesk. They're Russian. You know the the movie they did on me the forecaster um they translated in Donesk to Russian for Russian TV. All right. So they're not Ukrainian. All right. Um, and Ukrainians, [clears throat] the reason they were neo-Nazis is because they had no country. They joined Hitler and he said, "Join me

24:45 and I'll make sure you get a country." So, Bandera, what he did was start, it's the motherland of ethnic cleansing. They killed Jews by the hundreds of thousands. Uh, Hungarians, Polish. Uh, if you didn't speak Ukrainian, you were dead. This is what we are supporting. Um, nobody wants to talk about the truth, but you know, that's really it. So, uh geopolitically uh, you know, from a a metal standpoint, um, [clears throat] people keep thinking that, okay, fine.

25:31 Um, the Iran war, you know, we'll just defeat them. It'll be over with. and they and uh [clears throat] so the metals have uh gone into this decline since January uh and most likely will continue at least into August if not the first part of 27. Uh [clears throat] I think the the general consensus will have to shift when they realize that the problem with war is not who wins at this stage. What the problem with these wars is that

26:16 the debt um is going to expand dramatically. Europe is in dire straits. Um you have Mcronone um thinks he's Napoleon. They even call the the petite Napoleon. Um and [clears throat] he flew to uh Beijing before Trump and he said that Europe will no longer enter into a war outside of their territory, cutting off the Middle East. But he also told Jing [clears throat] they will not come to the rescue of Taiwan.

27:03 So was like giving him a green light. go ahead and take it. We're not going to interfere. Um, and so Trump goes there and that's what Jing put on the table. So um they didn't release a lot of statements from there, but look at what Trump said when he left. I recommend that chip companies move to America. Um, it's inevitable. I mean, they will take Taiwan probably, I would expect, at least in 2027. Um, but [clears throat]

27:50 we're just in this period of um, you need war when the economy goes down. And we're in a very steep um global recession area which will pick up after 26 into 28. That will be probably the bottom. Um and governments default when they can't sell new debt to pay off the old. We're in these Ponzi schemes. Okay. uh they can last as long as the the line at the door is to buy the next

28:35 tunch. Okay. But when you get into war, um Europe is is really in dire straits. Um, and you've just seen, you know, the Treasury and the Fed stepping up to try and help Japan. Um, again, you you have the the typical, I would say, uh, dollar bears. Oh, they're just trying to prevent them from selling US treasuries. Um, so they're not really helping Japan. That's all nonsense.

29:22 If you pick up the rug, who owns the bulk of US treasuries in Japan? It's not the government, it's corporates. And they buy treasuries. Why? Because it's a hedge against their own government. All right. Japan has the highest debt to GDP ratio in the world, you know, of any of the major countries. And [clears throat] I've warned for several years now that um [clears throat] we have two really risky debt crises that may pop up. First, Japan is one and the other is in the Middle East. People don't re look at this when during

30:10 COVID oil went down to $6.50. All right. What happened was [clears throat] the Gulf States couldn't function. So they took on massive debt. This is why [clears throat] Iran was attacking Dubai and they're attacking their [clears throat] uh refineries etc. All right. They know closing the straight of Harus isn't going to affect the United States in the same way as it was in the 70s because we're mostly self-sufficient. However, if they push up the price of

30:56 oil, Americans will have to pay higher for oil and gasoline. Period. However, [clears throat] that's just the superficial stuff. The real 3D chess move here by shutting down the the her moves. All right. and attacking refineries. If they can't if the Gulf States can't sell oil, they can't pay their debts. And then you get a banking crisis. You get defaults. So, they understand what's going on here. The press doesn't seem to. Uh, and I'm not entirely sure

31:43 the US even understands it either, but they're paying 3D chess here. Uh, and [clears throat] so the two most risky areas for a uh a sovereign debt crisis is Japan and in the Middle East. All right. Then throw in Europe. Um, as you know, um, I was called in, you know, and [clears throat] in creating the euro back then, and I warned them, this system's going to fail

32:30 because what happened was Hermit Cole didn't allow the German people to vote. So what he did was he took Germany into the euro [clears throat] without a public vote. So he assumed that the German people were against it because it would be maybe bailing out debt for Greece and Italy. So he said no consolidation of the debt. And [clears throat] the reason I warned them this is going to fail. In the United States, we have a single currency. Fine. But every we got 50 states and they all

33:16 pay different interest rates according to the credit rating. I said that's what's going to happen in Europe. So all the the nonsense, oh join the euro, you all get lower interest rates. That's as if it was federalized, not independent. Now, as a [clears throat] um an international hedge fund manager, I can't I could not make a decision between Europe and and treasuries. I can pick up the phone, say, "Buy me 10 billion in treasuries." No problem. I can't do that with Europe. I still have to make the same decision as if the euro didn't exist. Do I want

34:03 France? Do I want Germany? Do I want Italy? Whatever. So, you look at all the spreads between the peripherals. And you'll see what I'm talking about. They'll short Italy by Germany. Okay. Um, it's not the same as the United States. So consequently, they're in trouble. Economic growth in Italy is down to 0.5. They [clears throat] I can tell you that they did uh request that Brussels issue euro debt federally to help bail them out. So the pressure is building there in the EU as well. This is why

34:50 The dollar is the last one to fall. Okay, we're pretty much self-sufficient, but we have the biggest economy and the lowest cost of government to to GDP. For example, if you add up how much [clears throat] of uh government represents of GDP, the US is at about 35%. The EU is at 52. So half of every dollar earned goes to feed a bureaucrat. Produces nothing. All right. Um Canada is in the same boat. So US is

35:35 [clears throat] the number one place. This is why I've said before people were like because I said the stock market would go up but so would gold. they go how because some people will buy the gold, some people will buy the stock market, but it's foreign capital coming in. Um, I mean, I could tell you we got a lot of, you know, clients throughout the Middle East and after the attacks, they've been, you know, sending money to the US. So, you have all these people saying, "Oh, the stock market's going to crash." that kept making new highs for a year. They don't understand international

36:21 um capital flows or what's happening. Um the US [clears throat] was virtually bankrupt in 1896. It's when JP Morgan had to lend a bunch of gold to top up the Treasury to bail it out. But the end of World War I, the US became the financial capital. London shot itself in the foot. Then after World War II, US had 76% of the official world gold reserves. Why? Because you got tanks running down the the streets blowing everything up. Are you going to leave your money in the bank there? Everybody shifted it to the United States as much as they could. That's what even made 1929 because all the [clears throat] foreign

37:07 capital was here. They saw the auto boom, kind of like the dot bubble back then. All right. And they all stayed and that let's, you know, get in on this. Um because the industrial revolution was really happening here. Europe, you know, successfully blew itself out of the water. Um [clears throat] so that's capital will always flee from wherever a war takes place. And I can tell you like in Japan [clears throat] is we have numerous corporate clients there. They all have US treasuries as a hedge against their own government. All right. Um [clears throat]

37:55 you know they lowered interest rates that you know not so you earn nothing in Japanese yen. Um so they bought [clears throat] treasuries as war takes place over there. And I can tell you that capital's been starting to move from Taiwan to United States. Um, you get all these places that are starting to get geopolitical problems. The money gets out of town. So, our computer does show fine that the metals are going to go down. Uh, because a lot of people don't understand this yet. Um, but it it's looking like a pretty strong

38:41 bull market from 27 all the way into 2032. Uh, [clears throat] I'd expect gold to go up to at least set the 7,000 to 8,000 level. Um, with a shot of even reaching up to 11,000 by 2032. So it it's it's all a question of timing and [clears throat] right now they don't see uh the Middle East the consensus is that you know oh the US could just obliterate Iran um with no as if nothing else would happen. Uh and um you know these are just largely propaganda

39:27 that has been promoted by the neocons. Uh you can look on YouTube you also see Robert McNamera his apology before he died. He was the neocon took us into Vietnam and he and he says um publicly and he even wrote a book about it. They said we were wrong. We thought Russia was involved. It was just a civil war. 58,000 Americans died because the neocons. Oh, we got to get in there. This is Russia. You know, it's always Russia, Russia, Russia. You know, um and uh you know, it's the evidence shows it's been Israel that's been more in in uh

40:14 interfering in our elections than Russia. um because they want to keep the money flowing to the to their military etc. So um and then you even had just had I think it was the CIA just came out and listed Israel as as one of the the largest uh intelligence um [clears throat] problems for the United States. Uh so you know it's it's complicated [clears throat] but not really when you understand the facts. Uh you just got to get away from the propaganda that people put out there to support their own agenda one way or another. Um but I honestly I do not see any solution

41:02 um [clears throat] to you know China versus Taiwan, Ukraine versus Russia or US and Israel versus Iran. Um these are are philosophical differences that um for China, you know, that's where Shanghai fled to. Um and it's time to clean it up. You know, it's this is just the way unfortunately the way you know the world works. Then you have Ardan and Turkey um trying to form basically NATO of in the Middle East. Um he's got the largest

41:48 army. He's brought in Pakistan who's got the nukes and uh Saudi Arabia which has the money. So that tripartite arrangement, they're calling it the um the Middle Eastern version of NATO. Uh he keeps if you look at Erodan's comments, he's always anti um Israel. Um what's his objective? It's the same thing as Mcronone. Mcronone wants to rule Europe and Aidan wants to resurrect the Ottoman Empire. Um so I don't know. These people always seem to want, you know, pass glories or something. It's uh um

42:37 hard to say. >> So Martin, this the rise of gold, like you said, is not really a a US dollar story. It's more of a fiat story. You mentioned $11,000 gold by 2032, which is significant amount of debasement. If you were to, you know, switch those returns around, that's almost a 60% loss of purchasing power as expressed in gold. However, when you look at the state of government debts and the the sovereign debt that we're seeing, it almost sounds like a a smaller number than what is required to reset the debt levels and go back to a more more long-term average level. So, will the rise of hard assets like gold end in 2032 or is that just the start of it?

43:23 >> No. What our computer's showing is that uh 2032 will be more or less the collapse in republican forms of government. So we're going to end up with a new system hopefully maybe more direct democracy. Um they tell us we live in a democracy but we do not. Um that's propaganda too. Um even the pledge to allegiance says and for the the flag and for the republic for which it stands. Doesn't say democracy. Um, a republic [clears throat] is we elect somebody and they go and they make the decisions. We're never asked, uh, shall we go to war with Iran? They just do it. All

44:12 right. Um, [clears throat] you know, how many times has Congress, I mean, even issued a declaration of war? none since World War II. Um, so these neocons weasled their way into power. They're unelected. Um, the Biden administration was the turning point. Uh, there were three of them in there. You had Blink, you had Garland, and you had Victoria Nuland. Uh, and then look at their backgrounds. All three claimed that their families were from Ukraine or the Balkan area and all three claimed that their families

44:57 were persecuted by Russians. You know, how do three people with the same family background end up in the same administration? Um, but the we're not going to get back to a average debt level. the debt will default. Um maybe not the United States but as far as uh Europe is concerned look by law on average 70% of the pension funds must have government debt. Um they have totally screwed that up. They went negative in 2014. They didn't

45:42 get back to positive interest rates until 2022. Um they've wiped out their pension funds. This is why they need war. Um Mcronone uh is selling the idea that see Russia's weak. It hasn't been able to take um Ukraine. So we can go in and take them. And [clears throat] Putin called it a special operation. He did not try to conquer Ukraine. He was only in there for the dumbbas [clears throat] and Russia just recently changed that

46:30 because of Zilinsk's actions. Uh they no longer call it a special operation. They have now said we are at war with Ukraine. All right. Um, and I've been saying this on podcasts. People like, "Yeah, really?" I said, "Look, my my sources are pretty damn good." All right. Uh, and then all of a sudden the head of NATO came out and he didn't use Mcronone's name, but you can check a couple months ago he comes out and he says, "If you think you can conquer Russia without the United States, you are dreaming." This is what Mcronone's been pitching.

47:16 Why? Because Russia is the richest country in the world from a natural resource perspective. It's estimated they got about 75 trillion in the ground. All right. Um [clears throat] so what you're looking at is Mcronone has told Europe we don't need the United States. that because the Gaul took France out of NATO back in the 60s, they have their own nukes. All right? And so he's has been pitching that he can supply [clears throat] uh protect Europe with a nuclear umbrella and he's offered to put um

48:05 tactical nukes on German planes. So this is that's why they call him the petite Napoleon. He thinks that France will again rise from the ashes and rule Europe. Um so it's the same nonsense. It's just been this is Napoleon. It's been the Gaul. I mean it's they they just have this um inferiority complex. I mean, um, and it's all over language. I mean, I had a meeting with one of their top banks and I was told to bring in a a translator.

48:52 All right, fine. I bring a translator. And [clears throat] translating financial terms, you got to pay attention. It doesn't always come out correctly. Bull market can come out like a meat market. All right? So, [clears throat] I have to pay attention to what she's saying. Then I stop her and correct her and they look at me like, "Oh, you know what she's saying." I say, "Well, I'm not a complete idiot." Then they dismiss her and the meeting takes place in English. Uh, this is France. Uh I spoke at [clears throat] the BIS conference in Paris.

49:39 All right. So I sat at the head table. I was the keynote speaker. So I sat at the head table with all the heads of the central banks. Um the table starts speaking English. You see German, didn't understand Italian, etc. All right. And the host who was French uh sitting next to me, he was livid. This is Paris. We should be speaking French. You know, um my interpretation of dealing in Paris has been that they feel if Napoleon had won Waterloo, the world would be speaking French. So it it it's just

50:24 this attitude that you run into and it's all about language. Um I had a friend from Canada from Quebec and his daughter was going to go to France and I said, you know, she they won't speak French to her. Oh, what do you mean? I said, you'll see. They don't consider Canadian French. Uh they consider it like pig Latin. And she got there, they wouldn't speak French to her and they spoke English. And when she got back, she said called me and she says, "You're right. This is I says, "This is the way they are. What can I tell you?" And it's it's Quebec qua that's not French to them. Um,

51:11 so it's [clears throat] I mean it's this is where we're headed. You know, it it's you got all these biases and prejudices and um you know, I laugh at these people that call one world government. Really? You know, [clears throat] look at Congress. They don't all agree. How the hell are you going to get a one world government? You know, they're at each other's throats half the time. Uh so it this is just humanity. Um and so I don't see um even when they were forming the EU, I told them I said, "You don't understand what made America great." Um I said it was it was basically, you know discrimination.

51:58 They said, "Oh, how could you say that?" I said, "Because it was fair. Who was ever the last off the boat didn't get a job until they spoke English?" So you ask an American, "What are you?" He said, "Oh, I'm half Irish, half German, whatever." Which you don't see over there in Europe. Because the languages do keep them separate. I mean, sure, there's always some exception, but you know, you really think, you know, a French girl is going to bring home a German boyfriend and the father's going to say, "You do know what they did to us." You know, it's just, you know, I've been in Greece when Merkel was there trying to prevent uh, you know, bailing out the Greek banks and they were protesting down the street dressed as Nazis, you know. Um, the memories

52:46 have not faded. Um, so I don't really see, you know, everybody holding hands and singing Kaya. I mean it just you know that's not going to happen and I think it this is what the markets are reflecting. Uh and we have to just go through this. You go through it every roughly 300 years. The last time um we overthrew monarchy and adopted republics. It should have been a democracy, but they believed the fake news of Cicero uh from ancient times. Uh and

53:32 Cicero was part of the oligarchs basically. Um and so they didn't go with the Greek democracy. They went with uh the Roman Republic as the model. And this is what we got. Um, they can declare war, throw your ass in jail if you refuse to to go. Um, and you have no right to vote. You look at Vietnam. You're 18, right? For you could be drafted. Here's a gun. You were too young to even have a drink. No less vote. But that's democracy. uh you know it's um

54:20 unfortunately we just live live in a world of those in power um are only interested in their own power and I've probably dealt with more governments than anybody from um [clears throat] Middle East to you know to Asia. I don't see any difference no matter what they call themselves. Uh and [clears throat] Plato recorded a debate between Socrates and Thorasimakis and Thrasamakis said all forms of government are the same because justice is only the will of those in power.

55:06 Very true. It's uh [clears throat] you know this is the way it goes. Um, I mean, look, it's always about bribing, you know, power, you know, [clears throat] I've spoken to people on Capitol Hill and you had Jay Edgar Hoover had files on everybody and he would walk in and say, "Gee, this is what we found. I'm just letting you know if we found it, your opponent could Okay, fine. Thank you. Now you're on his leash. Um, this is the way it goes, Epstein. I

55:51 mean, I was warned in the 80s, be careful that they always use women to get into you. Um, anybody that really thinks that Epstein was about just young girls or something is, come on, it's delusional. You know, [clears throat] uh, what's the profit in this? He's bringing in not a buddy from from the local bar. All right. He's bringing in heads of state, you know, Clinton. And this is everybody he brought in [clears throat] had something that could be blackmailed. and his girlfriend

56:37 um Maxwell, her father, um who supposedly fell off the boat. Uh he's the one that funded the coup against Gorbachov in Russia. All right. He was probably killed for that reason. You know, the deal was that he supported the coup. Israel would recognize the coup government and they would allow all the Jews to go to Israel and [clears throat] Maxwell suddenly falls off his yacht. Um, and he can't swim. Uh, it's Look, this is stuff that's been going on for a long time. Um,

57:24 and [clears throat] you know the real question even with Epstein, it's not what he did, it's who paid him to do it. Because like I said, this is not somebody at the local bar, hey, you want to go have some fun with some girls or whatever. This is bringing in heads of state. This is different. Um, [clears throat] and I was warned about that a long time ago. And I don't if you remember Elliot Spritzer, he took down the head of AIG. He was given information and set in motion by guys on Wall Street because AIG would

58:11 not fund, not ensure all the the [clears throat] CDOS's that Goldman was selling. So he's taken out. Suddenly, AIG ensures all that stuff. All right. Miraculously, Epstein didn't realize he was being used as a pawn. He then said, "Oh, now I've got the power and he's going to turn against Wall Street." What happens? Oh, look at these checks. He paid hookers and he had to resign. This is the way it goes. Um, you know, the head of the IMF, they want to get rid of him. Oh, he, you know, he

58:56 molested the maid in the in the room. I mean, it's always some something to get rid of people that are blocking them. So, this is what 2032 is about. The system is just so corrupt. Um, and [clears throat] Look, the neocons, they don't really care who's in power. You had Dick Cheney [clears throat] endorse Camila. Um, it's whoever is going to give them what they want, which is war and power. That's it. They could care less what and about the country, about taxes.

59:42 None of that matters. Um, look, I knew Bill Crystal back then. It's uh his father's the one that started the whole thing. He even spoke at one of our conferences. So, I I'm not talking about conspiracy theories. I've actually been there, had dinner with people. So, um, I know what this is really about. >> An incredibly bleak prediction. I would love to squeeze in one more quick question if you have the time, Martin. >> Mhm. I would love to get your sense for where oil prices would be headed. Of course, on the one hand, we're balancing what you outlined earlier where you believe we might be looking down the barrel of a recessionary period bottoming potentially in 28. On the other hand, it seems like we're seeing

1:00:28 imminent physical shortages uh on the on the oil side. So, how do you think oil prices will develop over the next few years? >> Uh higher actually. I mean, this is where Zillinsky comes in. Um, on top of you got the straight harm, then you got the hoodies going after the Red Sea, and then you got Zalinsky attacking all the refineries in in Russia. There are even shortages of gasoline in Russia. Now, um, so that's what I mean. These people do not look beyond the end of their nose. I have to defeat Russia. That's all I care about. Okay. What's it going to do to the world economy? Well, that's not my problem.

1:01:15 Um and I don't see this as basically um a bare market. I think you are looking at shortages. Um, and China is a major, you know, importer. So is India. I mean they're talking about in India even doing uh lockdowns for energy. Um I can tell you that there have been some discussions of that in Europe. Um so I don't see this as um subsiding um from the Middle East may get far worse. Um,

1:02:04 and uh, on top of that, you just you you have Russia um, and you got Zalinsky going after everything they they possibly can. So, I don't I don't see this as subsiding. Um, so the recessionary period is going to be more like a stagflation thing of the 70s where the cost you're looking at a cost push inflation. All right. So the costs go up um which defeats kynesian economics. raising interest rates is not going to make more

1:02:50 oil. Yeah. Uh it only makes it more expensive. This is why the central banks are in really trouble because Keynesian economics is is is dead. Um all the economic theories that people have used, quantity, you know, quantity of money, all this stuff, all that was based upon a [clears throat] gold standard fixed exchange rate. So there was never a consideration of [clears throat] international capital movement, anything of that nature. Uh if you have a a building in New York, you sell it to me for 10 million. It's just my money to

1:03:37 your account. However, if a somebody from London comes in, says, "I'll give you the 10 million." they got to bring that capital in. So it increases the money supply. It's got nothing to do with the Federal Reserve. Okay? So these are are realities that didn't exist before. Okay? When the you [clears throat] get into international investment, [clears throat] one of the greatest risks first you have to look at country risk then currency risk. So it's nice I can say all right fine I can buy the stock market's going to double but the currency is going to fall

1:04:22 by 50%. I make nothing. All right. So you you have to look at the whole picture. And unfortunately um all the economic theories that we grew up on and were taught in school and are still being taught in school are wrong. They've never um adopted to a floating exchange rate system. Um, the only economist I ever met who understood it was Milton Friedman. Um, and most of them didn't want to listen to Freeman. So, look, that's the way government works.

1:05:11 You know, Freeman, I liked Milton. One of his quotes was, "If you put the government in charge of the Sahara Desert, there'd be a shortage of of sand within a few years." Um, whereas [clears throat] Kees is saying, "You have the power. You can control the world. Follow what I'm saying and the people will have to do what you say." You know, and we've done studies on this stuff. I mean, you can correlate the stock market and interest rates. They've never peaked with the same level of interest rates twice in history. Why? Because honestly, if you think the stock market will double, you'll pay 20%

1:05:58 interest. But if you don't think it's going to go up 1%, you won't pay one. So, it's not the level of interest rate. And all of that has been inverted thanks to socialism. You know, I did a book back in ' 86 and we're going to have to redo it again cuz they go in on uh eBay for $3,000. Um was called the greatest bull market in history. And I had to read all the newspapers to to really grasp the thinking process inverted. Before 29, if interest rates went up, it

1:06:44 was bullish. Why? Their interpretation was there's still a demand for money. So therefore, it's bullish. after that with Keynesian. Oh, the Fed's raising interest rates because they don't want us to buy. It's got nothing to do with economics. Um, oh, it will cost you more to borrow money. As I said, if you think it's going to double, you'll pay 20. You know, all that nonsense about Keynesian economics is absolutely out the window. Um and >> [clears throat] >> Just look at the a chart of the Fed and

1:07:31 interest rates. When Trump came into power first in 16, they raised interest rates all the way through. Stock market rallies. They called it the Trump rally. They didn't pay attention to the interest rates then. you know, it's um you know, it's unfortunately it's propaganda by the socialists basically and it's all about government trying to manipulate us and um do this or we're going to punish you or whatever. Um [clears throat] and so I warned them in in uh [clears throat] in the in Europe, I

1:08:17 said, you know, they're going negative. I said this is not going to force people to spend. They went negative in 2014. They finally threw in the towel in 2022. But it's this idea of [clears throat] I lower the interest rates, they can't earn interest, so they'll spend the money. They're not politicians. Okay? If you don't have faith in the future, you're not going to spend it. you're going to stuff it underneath a mattress. And [clears throat] when they went with negative interest rates, the number one thing that people were buying were home safes. They took money out of the bank, stuffed it in their safe, and said, "Screw you."

1:09:04 Um, so it's, you know, that's the, you know, we're we're facing a complete political change and part of what we're talking about here with economics and the theories and things of that nature. Um, this is what's coming. I mean, I I won't say what university, but one of the top five asked me to go to lunch. I went to lunch. They asked me if I would teach. I said, I don't want to teach in a university. I said, "Why are you even asking me?" And they actually said to me, I swear to God, they actually said to me, "We know

1:09:50 what we teach doesn't work." I said that's the first step. And they also said I wasn't the only one they asked. They asked other, you know, uh, hedge fund managers or whatever. They said, "Nobody wants to come back." I said, "Who wants to go back and teach a a room with 30 kids, you know, it's not something you really want to do in life." I said, 'I'll be glad to do a guest lecture or something, but you know that's it. I'm not going to be there every day. Sorry. >> Well, Martinez has been incredibly illuminating. I would love for you to talk about Armstrong economics.

1:10:35 >> Um, honestly, we were probably the first firm that got involved in foreign exchange. um mainly because um I [clears throat] at least understood foreign exchange. My father had taken me in in the family to Europe for the summer of 64. So I every time you cross the border you had to change currency. So that in really introduced me to it which uh wasn't being taught in school. And then I happened to have had a a friend who was an executive VP at Franklin National Bank. And that's the first bank that failed because of the floating exchange rate in

1:11:21 1974. And he said, "Look, would you come take a look at this? I think it's something you know about." the bank went down for a 10% loss on the Italian lera. So after that, uh, just about every currency crisis you name it, I've been called into creating the G5, 87 crash, 97 crash, I got called into China, um, creating the euro. I mean, uh, it it's I'm just the guy that they ended up going and so, you know, we've created a, uh, [clears throat] an artificial intelligence system that's monitoring

1:12:08 the entire world. It's got basically a 50-year track record. Uh, and the computer writes over a thousand um, reports every day all by itself on instruments around the world. Um, so we probably have the largest institutional client base of anybody because you have an international portfolio. Um, we're the only ones that are covering the entire world with the same system. Um, if you got get somebody from India, then they do it differently than somebody from Thailand. And then you got some you know you can't have a different person in each country

1:12:55 um because it's not unified. How do you make that those decisions? So with our system um we have a lot of the major uh multinational companies and uh that use it and central banks etc. So it's it's more of because they know it's not a personal opinion. It's the computer doing it unbiased. Um, and we're not blocked even in China. I mean, it's we got offices there, too. Um, they know you don't have to worry about on page three, by the way, overthrow your government or something, you know. Um, so it it's been an an interesting journey. Um,

1:13:41 it certainly has given me a front row seat over the years. Um, so I get to see a lot of this stuff. Um, [clears throat] and you know, I get called into all sorts of different things. Um, was called in to, you know, help write the the peace plan for to hand [clears throat] to Putin. Uh, so it's, you know, it's been very interesting ride, I would say, so far. >> We'll make sure to put the link in the description. Martin Armstrong, thank you so much for your generosity with your time and also your insights. Tremendously appreciate it. >> Well, thank you for inviting me. I hope that uh opens the door for some of your

1:14:28 listeners so they can look at the world a little bit differently. >> For sure. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. This podcast is for general information purposes only and does not constitute investment advice, an offer or solicitation to buy or sell any securities. The views expressed are those of the host and guest and do not necessarily reflect the views of the company or their affiliates. Guests on the show are not compensated for their appearance. Certain discussions may include forward-looking statements subject to known and unknown risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. Listeners should do their own research, consult a licensed financial advisor, and not base any investment decisions solely on the information discussed. For a full

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