Sarah Jane Smith - Series One - 20th Anniversary Special

0:00 we would play Sarah now Gary said you know she was a child of the 80s but play her um and what had happened and that intrigued me and that sort of buzzed around for for a little while I thought well yes I I am me and as I've gone on in life you know you think I played a character and that character is nothing like me it's you know I step into the role and I've come to you know really take a back seat and think I'd use more of myself than I thought so I thought well I can use myself now and I'm still Sarah [Music] foreign [Music]

1:05 foreign files this is the science of audio the show that explores the universe of Doctor Who and the audio medium I'm Dwayne and I'm Philip get a durangoday audiophiles g'day Philip it's a really special episode we've got for our final full episode for 2022 and so I'm very happy to be uh sharing this as our last episode of the Year we're featuring Sarah Jane Smith series one because it's the 20th anniversary and this was your suggestion Philip so it must have a very special place in your heart it does have a special place in my heart I mean I loved them when they first came out Elizabeth Slade has a special place in my heart as well which is part of the reason this has a special place and money this has got bigger than I did expect it when I suggested it early in

1:51 the year but it's a yeah it's a pretty exciting tribute to a great first season of Sarah Jane Smith yes because very soon we're going to be doing a retrospective on Series 2 as well but at series one that's got the 20th anniversary stick around because we're going to be chatting with a few different people involved with the production including director producer Gary Russell we're going to be talking with Jess Fielder and we're going to be showing some archive footage from Sadie Miller her chat with us unfortunately said he wanted to join us for this but she couldn't for this time so we'll see what we can do for series two we're also going to be speaking with David Bishop who wrote one of the stories and Peter angelides so some really fascinating insights that we've got coming up on

2:36 this fantastic series that you can get as a complete sort of box set download now from bigfinish.com you can and at the moment if you're listening to this within the first week of coming out it's on special and very cheap so it's really worth going and buying it if you haven't already done it yes so we can highly recommend that so what do you remember about the series Philip as as a whole when it first came out how were you feeling about the first series of Sarah Jane Smith well this was still very early on in the whole big finish range and so it hadn't been going for that long I guess it's been good a couple of years but um this was one of the big Branch aways which and probably the one I was most excited about so you know Sarah Jane Smith has always been huge in my my life and of course at the time when when big

3:22 finish started there was the policy of if you know if there was no doctor for the companion the companion just didn't appear because they weren't going to feature companions without the doctors and because Tom Baker at that stage wouldn't work with big finish it seemed like there was no hope of Ever Getting Sarah Jane onto the show and so when this was announced I was really excited because Sarah Jane's always been my favorite companion so to actually get a box set of you know well it was it would have been a boxer today but a series of five plays was just so exciting what was your first feelings my first memories I don't have any strong memories of when it was actually released but there was a time when the whole series one and series two had been released that my daughter and I she was oh she must have been eight or nine at the time and Sarah

4:09 Jane Smith uh the Sarah Jane Smith Adventures on television had just Ed and she was a huge fan of that so on this road trip we listened to all of these I quickly discovered that the Sarah Jane Smith big finish stories were a little bit more adult than the TV episodes so we cracked on and we we listened to them and she enjoyed them and she was she was a huge fan of Sarah Jane as well because of the television series so that's my overriding memory of that that road trip where I listened to all of them on that one road trip so very very fond memories for me but I understand Philip that you have an even more special memory of Elizabeth sladen that comes from just before this was released my uh big memory Elizabeth sladen

4:54 um as you know aside from when she appeared in Australia but I had nothing much to do other than just you know I saw her on stage was I went to a convention on Newcastle on time um in in England so I'd been traveling overseas and this convention I wanted to get to and I met a whole heap of Doctor Who people there but when I when I met um Elizabeth on the first day on the Saturday and you know went up and you know had my photos taken with her and got her to do some autographing she sort of commented on the fact I was Australian so I guess I've come over to Australia and a large part was just to beat you I didn't sell it to her but the last part of why I was there was because yeah gonna be Elizabeth slated and she said oh well you know why don't we yeah do you want me to The Barley it's nice and you could buy me a drink so no yeah okay and so we arranged about eight o'clock in the bar when yeah all the all that

5:40 stuff's over and yeah and I'd arrived and we both sort of got the same time and there was a table free so we took the table and I still said oh what do you want to drink and she said well how long do you want to chat with me for I said uh yeah as long as you've got so she said well you better buy a bottle then um so whenever I got a got a bottle of wine and we came and sat down and yeah we had a bottle and people would keep coming over and chatting with us and joining us and leaving again but I just had a whole evening with Elizabeth sladen and it's one of those most special moments of my life so he didn't have to give it a second thought then get that bottle of wine uh no all the second bottle of wine that I got as well it was very well worth the price of every cent that those two bottles cost me uh was worth every cent would you say

6:28 that that is your most memorable Doctor Who Fan Experience I've had a few but that one is certainly up there excellent but before we get into our interviews we might bring up Gary Russell first but before we do that we'll we'll start off with giving a brief rundown on the first episode that was released in the Sarah Jane Smith series which was called comeback it was written by Terence Dix and shall I read the blurb that's a great idea six months after the last part of her undercover investor give TV series for Planet 3 broadcasting went out Sarah giant Smith is Running Scared living under false names her true identity compromised she has few friends and fewer Clues as to

7:13 her pursuers enter three people who will change her life The Mysterious Mr Harris old friend Ellie Martin and a guardian angel in the shape of the roguish Josh Townsend now all roads lead to the Village of kloots coombe in Wiltshire but will she find the answers she needs there well Lavinia I hope you liked your day in the Limelight I think you'd have hated it actually all those people going on about how wonderful how successful how much a pillar of society were Sarah Jane Smith [Music] first I lose the house in Denham then

7:59 the flattened chalk farmer now this one one day I just may get to unpack I know you're a famous investigative reporter yeah well it used to be um let's just say the investigating reporter racket's been falling off a bit recently since well there I'm must correct you the correct title is old cluteus will conclude as I'm sure you know is another name for the devil it was always a place of power the Christian Church took it over as it did so many Pagan places and festivals they were still there abiding its time this is Harris I have a job for Mr shakravati come on you I think it might be safer to take public transport what about your car welcome to my world Mr tarden I think I shall be

8:46 asking some important questions of your representative tomorrow you really shouldn't do that vicar are you threatening yes I rather think I am good afternoon Harris how is Miss Smith in mourning nothing compared to how she'll be tomorrow morning [Music] okay Philip have you got some quick facts on the story for me Yep this has come back the facts of the trivia so written as you said by Terrence Dix recorded the 7th of March 2002 at the motor Studios and released July 2002 starring Elizabeth sladen Jeremy James and Sadie Miller though Jeremy James Wilson's jez fielder who we're meeting

9:32 later directed by Gary Russell a music and sound design by David Darlington although this was the first Story released it was actually the last story to be recorded Sadie Miller is the daughter of Elizabeth sladen and Brian Miller Sadie was in drama school at the time that this was recorded David Jackson is best known for his betrayal as Gan in Black 7 and this was to be his only big finish outing Robin Bowman as the Baddie Harris was added after he had been so successful in the third story test of nerve Robin Bowman is the brother of Lisa Bowman beat finishes of Bernie Summerfield also director the opening scene was written by Gary Russell and named checked several people who were in K-9 company davidia Smith Brandon Richards and Juno Baker

10:18 playing Ellie Martin Juliet Warner re-recorded several scenes on this day from the previous production she'd done because originally she was the book companion character Sam Jones but now it was changed back to a different character because they thought Sam Jones made the whole thing too cluttered thank you for that Philip I think the the one thing that stands out for me is I really like the way this is written actually it's Terence Dix's only contribution to Big finish apart from I think he did something called Rebecca's world uh he also did he redid the places play The Seven Keys doomsday oh right and he did a companion Chronicle based on that okay so he actually so he did a couple of things so I'm glad I'm glad

11:04 you checked me on that so that's good he didn't do an awful lot so I enjoyed it for that but what I enjoyed this mostly for apart from Sarah Jane Smith obviously was David Jackson he plays the villain so well and as a Blake 7 fan I'd not seen David Jackson in any other role other than Gan so to see him playing that nice guy throughout there it was such a contrast to playing the villain and he was so good at it do you agree oh it was wonderful I mean he's got a voice that just melts uh it's just beautiful voice but yes he was just despicable and it was yeah wonderful to see and you know huge Play Seven fan I think by this stage Jacqueline Pearce had already appeared in some big fitish audios I

11:49 think off the top of my head is probably on the second like so oh no selling a bit would have been already in spare parts by now too but you know slowly bit by bit um Blake said people were coming across but unfortunately I mean I think I think um David Jackson would have been more except for he's very untimely and early death yeah that was such a shame but anyway this is an excellent story which uh you would have got a taste of in the trailer but we want to talk to some of the people involved in it and we're going to start off with Gary Russell now when we when we had Gary Russell on the first thing we asked was obviously how did Sarah Jane Smith the series come about it was 100 my idea and I said to Jason I wanted to do a spin-off we said our first spin-off because we

12:36 hadn't done Gallifrey at that point Nick had done Dalek Empire and possibly diet War hadn't done Cybermen I didn't think and so I suggested Jason I wanted to do a spin-off as well and I wanted to do Sarah Jane uh because I just thought well oh Cosby that's right yes that's where it goes back to we'd work with Liz right at the very beginning on the Benny's uh she had come in and walked into Babylon and I think in conversations with her she was like what are you because we did we have the Doctor Who license I think we had just had our first meeting with the BBC about possibly getting the Doctor Who license it was around that time and so it obviously was something we were

13:22 talking about um and she must have said you know oh well I don't think I'd ever want to play Sarah Jane again I like playing the past I'm playing in Babylon but I wouldn't want to play Sarah Jane again kind of red rag to a book for me uh so that yeah three or four years later I'm saying to Jason I want to do Sarah Jane um and I think Jason's side but Liz said you and I said oh no you leave this to me um so I I phoned her up one day out of the blue and said right madam you said you didn't want to play Sarah Jane however rather than team you up with a doctor and may have you playing you know second fiddle as you have done many times in the past and I promise there won't be a tin dog how do you fancy the idea of a four-part

14:09 Sarah Jane series out on our own in the world being an investigative journalist but doing sort of spooky x-filesy kind of things and she said no straight away and I went go on no go on then I think after about 10 minutes of go on no go on no it turned into right we'll have a coffee so we went we met up at Bond Street Station a few days later and we went out for a coffee and she said right when we do this this is what you're going to do we're going to do this and I was like yeah yeah that's all fine she was Liz was always incredibly protective of Sarah Jane she she just lived and breathed the character she knew the character backwards so she knew what Sarah Jane wooden wouldn't do in given

14:56 situations and I was like well yeah you know there's no point in asking you to come and do this series and then giving you stuff you don't want to do so obviously everything you're talking about will factor in I think there are a couple of things I pushed back on and said I don't think actually that's the direction I'd want to take Sarah I want to take it more in the spooky supernaturally kind of thing but with a scientific basis and so we compromised in the middle on there um and she had no it major um demands or anything there was no sort of my dressing room must have red Smarties in it or anything like that she did say would there be a chance of having a walk-on part as you do on audio

15:43 um for Sadie and I know I mean I've known Sadie since she was a bump in Liz's tummy um so that was you know I was like yeah of course I knew Sadie was doing acting at that point um and actually I created a main character for it which I think through Liz a little bit and I'm not sure that with hindsight that might not have been the best idea because then immediately I think Liz thought oh you're doing this because you might replace me for a second season with my daughter and it was like no you said you wanted a nice part for for Sadie and I thought the best thing I can do is make her your companion um and then we added in uh Jesse's character as well and it was quite it was quite fun because when they met up I

16:31 know that Liz and Jazz met before we recorded I can't think whether they met at a big Finnish party or certainly something they'd work together they got an account on fire so she was immediately relaxed she had Sadie with her she had jez weather she had me she was happy to do this um she wanted she wants script approval at all she wanted writer approval so her idea was deaf I the first writer I had was David Bishop he wrote the first script actually that's the one I sent her we commissioned it um Jason agreed to commission Dave Bishop script before we had a series so that Liz could see what we were doing so that's the first one we wrote in the first one we actually recorded

17:19 um and she said I think you should get Barry let's to do one and I said that appeals to me enormously um I used to have at Terence I wanted to bring Terence into big Finnish for a long time she was really up for that so that was my next protocol was to phone both Barry and Terence that evening and say we're doing a series of Liz yep they were on board uh Terrence I asked to write the first one Barry I asked to write the second one and then I had I got Rupert and Pete Ranch lead he's involved um I think Peter is the only person I didn't give a storyline to in any way shape or form I mean I was very loose with what I gave Dave Bishop Rupert I gave a sort of scenario too and he moved it to Eastern Europe which I

18:05 thought was interesting Peter came up completely with his own um Terence I gave a storyline to I said you know I want spooky village where everything's a bit ooh because that feels a good entry point for the show and I gave a storyline to Barry which he didn't like so he came back with with the one about uh all the Dow stuff um so I had my my five brilliant Scripts did Barry originally do a story about Voodoo and had to be changed to taoism is that right yeah no it wasn't about Voodoo per se uh sorry yes you've forgotten that it was

18:50 uh it was a about black culture in Southeast London um and I think it was Dominic that probably said to Barry dad that is the most racist thing you've ever written you cannot possibly submit that script it wasn't really that it was about Voodoo I think there might have been a little bit of the sort of that cultural appropriation in it um I never saw any of this that never even got to me I didn't even see a storyline about it um I just remember Barry saying you know I was thinking of doing this but Dominic says that's probably not a good idea because it might be seen as a bit racist and I think I remember saying to him yeah I would be decidedly uncomfortable with that um and he said well the only thing I would be quite happy to do something about is Taoism and I thought well

19:36 there's no one in the world that knows more about it than you um so he went and did that and what I loved is um he gave us a big finish his first gay villain um and made him a real bastard as well and I really liked that fact I you know I was like yeah everyone every time somebody writes gay people into anything connected with Dr King there was nice people and actually some of us can be complete and it was good to have a villain who was a completely Nutter and I really really like that all right Phillip so we'll jump in here and talk about Story number two which is by now already been mentioned by by Gary written by Barry Lett so it was pretty cool to have Barry let's enter and sticks involved in this series and of course if anyone's going to write about some kind of religious connection

20:22 it's going to be barilets and his story is called the Dao connection I'll read the blurb for it the body of an old man is found floating in the Thames although the DNA of the corpse corresponds to an 18 year old friend of Josh and Ellie Sarah Jane heads towards West Yorkshire in a bid to discover what killed the man why someone is kidnapping homeless teenage boys and whether there is a link between that and the retreat of philanthropist will Buckley which hosts the huangti clinic Sarah discovers that there is more to ancient dark sorcery than she previously believed my name's Toby Davenport page 17. 18 now I suppose go back and get it right you

21:09 straight up Cub it's a perfect match [Music] foreign they thought he might have gone back up north but at the weekend he rang Mike at the shelter a bit spooked so Mike thought if he loses this spot to one of the gangs he'll have to start all over again could be one of mine if I had any but just to be wiped off the face of this I mean it's as bad as Argentina okay okay I get your drift I and the word Dao itself means the way a way of life certainly but far more than that one

21:54 might call it the way of nature it is the Stillness beneath the turmoil of creation the emptiness which is the mother of the ten thousand things The Eternity in the present moment once you mentioned Toby's name it is clammed up you don't understand I my age if I go without more than one I'll I'll Peg out kick the bucket Shuffle off this Mortal coil or is die the words you're looking for yes of course Sarah Jane Smith the [Music] the dial connection the facts and the trivia written by Barry lets recorded

22:39 the 27th of February 2002 at the mode Studios and released in August 2002 starring Elizabeth sladen Jeremy James and Sadie Miller directed by Gare Russell and music and sound design David Darlington Barry Letts was the producer of Doctor Who between 1969 and 1974 and cast Elizabeth sladen as the role of Sarah Jane Smith he originally had a storyline about Voodoo but when his son read through it he some thought it might cause a fence and so it was changed to taoism he is the only this is the only story that Barry litz would write for me finish Sarah uses venusian Aikido that she learned from an old friend a department c19 is mentioned here which was previously mentioned in both time flight and project Twilight thank you very much Philip I thought it was a this was a

23:27 very strange story but it's always one that really sticks in my head and I think this is really weird and then by the end of it it is it sort of comes together really well I kind of find myself thinking all the way through what is going on here and then it sort of comes together real I don't know whether you felt the same Philip yeah it's it is a very and it's a bit more unusual it's a bit more tortured actually this is probably yeah true it's quite gruesome in Parts it is and it feels quite Torchwood um in fact I think all these stories in some ways feel a bit tortured in in terms of the monster down the world this first season in particular and the the um the thing I love is um Elizabeth Slade is Northern Performance um I think originally they were playing they wanted her to do a different sort of accent but I think it was a slave and talked about the fact that well she

24:12 comes from Liverpool so doing a northern accent was much more natural for her to move into and so the whole scenes where she's playing the uh the maid and using the northern accent I think is quite delightful and once again you just see this developing relationship between her and Josh and the way they play with each other so it's nice having the the Sarah Jane's the main character with the companion being being Josh and then you've got the brains behind the whole scene um with Sadie but some lovely scenes throughout this and it's a bit disturbing but interesting that's the word disturbing is the word for sure but uh it's it's one that certainly stands out in my mind in the series that's for sure so by now we have heard of

24:58 Jeremy James AKA Jazz Fielder and we had the opportunity to have a great discussion with him didn't we Phillip it was an amazing night he was a lot of fun and just kept talking and talking and I learned so much about so many things and when you hear others make comments about jazz you certainly get what they're saying when you're actually talking with him but of course with the name Jeremy James which he has a lot of credits for in Big finish and Jazz Fielder which he also has a lot of credits for in Big finish our first question obviously was about the name now if we look at the credits on Sarah Jane Smith we won't find this Fielder there here we go we'll find Jeremy James so who are you well

25:44 um I'm obviously a torn man that you have before um Jeremy James well well um there's a name I haven't heard for a very long time no it's um it's actually my my name is my name is Jeremy James Fielder um and foolishly or otherwise when I when I started um acting I through on the advice of no one other than myself I said I should have a stage name and I don't know what decade I thought I was in um but it wasn't the one I was and I thought oh no I'll be I'll call myself wasn't there a great season with nail and I doesn't really Grant say what do you think I think I'm calling myself

26:30 Donald Sway and it was a bit like that and then I was chatting away with some some friends in there like well you could just call yourself you know Jeremy and I I actually really hate the name Jeremy I've always hated it so I became jez a very very young age and then my parents don't call me Jeremy but Jeremy James sandwiched me to have the story requisite gravitas or ludicrousness that was was uh called for in this circumstance and I just went with it and then the first I think um yeah so I think I think I was I was down as Jazz fielder for the first the first ever big finish I did and then it was after that you swing back but you swing backwards and forwards you've got 44s Jeremy James and 18 as Jess Fielder

27:16 so you were actually swinging backwards and forwards constantly throughout your whole time no I know I didn't I don't I didn't over there was a it was a it was Jazz Fielder when I did the so the second ever big finish was called phantasmagoria yes 1991 you don't need me to tell you this this is why you're this you're the expert and it was written by um Mark Gates and it's the first it was the first acting job I I ever had in my life um and I'd I'd met Nick Briggs uh in a pub he'll be unsurprised to hear in in Hastings um which is a town on the on the south south coast of England where there was a very famous battle a thousand years ago um and uh I was playing in a band um singing and playing the electric

28:02 guitar and after the gig Nick Briggs who I'd never met before in my life just introduced himself I said oh hello my name's Nick and I'm a producer um I'd like you to do some work for me would you be interested of course I've just come off stage singing and playing the guitar haven't I so when someone says I'm a producer you expect to be a music producer so that's what I thought he was and I said oh right um of course let's I mean let's we can have a chat what is it you need you need um you need session do you need vocals guitar what he went oh no of course you think that no no no no no um sorry let's start again um I'm um Nicholas Briggs and I'm an audio drama producer and I really like your your voice in between songs so that's basically he enjoyed the banter with the audience

28:49 between it wasn't anything to do with my music and I said I've been vaguely insulted but no it was really nice we had a beer and had a chat and he said look it's it's Doctor Who and I was oh well if it's okay then sold whatever it is I don't care let's go so oh are you a fan of the show I said well I'm not the guy that I was playing in a band with his name's John Ewing and his brilliant brilliant one of the best drummers of your generation and he's a proper proper hovian like he's got that he's got the bookshelf he's got the kind of tardis bookshelf and opens up and you know all the videos are in there and he's got all he knows everything about it and he quotes it um I just I just kind of liked it and watched it with um with Tom Baker and Peter Davidson when I was a kid so but I was a but I

29:34 was a really big fan of Tom Baker um and kind of followed him his career and everything he did after Doctor Who as well because I just thought he was mesmerizing so after a couple of years just doing all sorts of bits and pieces with a big finish they asked you well have you hear about the Sarah Jane Smith stories yeah so I knew you were going to ask me that and I and I had to really rack my brains to remember this because this is about this is over 20 years ago now just about and but I do remember it was the 20th anniversary we really see this to celebrate the 20th anniversary yeah oh there we go yes we we we recorded it in February 2002 I think so yeah oh I see happy anniversary everyone um yeah Gary Russell

30:20 um took me out onto the balcony of a party and I can't remember whose party it was but it was quite late and he said oh I've got something I really need to talk about it's really important um and I said well I'm I'm here let's let's no no we need to I need to talk to you properly we went out to this balcony it was quite out there and he said how do you feel about being um a companion and I said what to a you mean to a doctor no no no to uh to a doctor's companion in a special they're gonna do I said stop being cryptic what is what are you talking about he said well I don't know how much you know about Doctor Who because this is still quite early on you know we I'd

31:06 probably done about a three or four audios um at this point and I was just getting involved in the Judge Dread stuff and the Dalek Empire stuff is coming later that uh the following year so I you know I hadn't I hadn't had countless um conversations with with the lads about you know how much I was into Doctor Who and certainly wasn't into it in anywhere near as much as they were but I had a bit of a grasp of it and he said do you know who Sarah Jane Smith is I said yes I do so well we're gonna we're gonna write this is this is all very hush hush I don't know why it was but um we're going to write a series um with Sarah Jane Smith as the main character and we'd like you to be her her companion a psychic I don't know is that something you'd be interesting yes I'll do that brilliant

31:53 he says have you ever met Liz no never met Liz okay well we'll make sure you two meet at some point but um basically um I need to ask you some just a few things about about your life I was like what do you want to know about my what's that got to do with it he said well because we're kind of basing him on you I was like oh really is he a international rockstar no no he isn't ignore you so shut up so um I think so Josh went to University in Glasgow and so did I and there's kind of there's a few parallels and the the timeline's quite similar I I I I should put on record background I was going to say I haven't got I haven't been young offenders institution but you are but you are a hero

32:39 well that's about a matter of opinion um but um certainly it was it was very flattering actually that but I just got on with everyone like everyone I work with and we know on those early big finish ones we just had a really nice time and I wasn't that wasn't difficult to work with and you know I wasn't a not not that lots of people are but you know it was just easy they were like bring him in he'll be all right and they'll get and they thought I'd get on with Liz and I didn't know Liz and I didn't know anything about her other than who she was and I've seen I'd seen her I'd sit next actually I should tell you this story um um so the the a few weeks a couple of months

33:24 pass and there's a there's a big Finnish party they used to have them quite regularly but um I don't know what happened but um now they're kind of every 10 years but there was a Christmas party and I don't I can't remember where it was it all blurs into one but um Gary was there and he said oh great you're here Liz is here I said all right so that's still happening then he said yeah yeah yeah oh it's still going on you're still interested right I said yeah well you have got to meet and and I'm going to find her come with me we'll find Liz so we found found Liz um I don't know where Liz was but she was there somewhere and um Liz Leyden Mr Jess Fielder it's going to be your companion oh hello I've heard so much about you I said hello Liz I said and this strike this this

34:09 so she just looked the same as she did in Doctor Who was really odd it's like this striking the Striking woman um beautiful beautiful woman and just like wow just she just kind of has this Aura and I just thought that other than obviously thinking she was gorgeous I was just really pleased to meet her and then we just started chatting away and Gary was sort of oh the end of look on his face like um oh God I thought he was going to say something awful and he hasn't I'm really pleased that kind of relieved face um but I didn't let him down after that because uh I said um she asked me what I'd have whether I'd seen Doctor Who and you know know anything about the character I said yeah I've seen I've seen a lot of the stuff with uh well I didn't I haven't seen

34:54 much as much of the stuff with John I saw a lot of the stuff with Tom Baker she's like okay so you kind of you're you're conversant with what the character said oh yeah absolutely I said and um and I saw because I had um I saw canine and Company I saw that pilot um episode oh you shouldn't have said that well it gets worse that was entirely my fault as well um and actually this is a great barometer for for Liz so so I said I saw canine and Company and I could get that to audibly hear Gary go yeah and she goes oh yes um what did you think of that then and I said I said oh no I thought it was they came

35:41 across really well she said really I went no and Gary went oh God and this and Liz started laughing and then Gary's like oh she's laughing oh she thinks it's funny yeah and then he starts laughing as well out of sheer relief and um and at that moment I was like me and her are going to get on just fine and um and we we did so that's that's what happened at the beginning of of um that's how we we got together and then they introduced us and it we sussed each other out and it was there was no question it was going to be it was going to be fine because she's got a she's got a wicked sense of humor and I think she enjoyed it because she probably went home and told her family that was an ass she covered it up well if that's the case it's weird but I I think it looks quite

36:27 like pertwick but we was younger I don't know how he would take that and actually I told him and I think he's incorporating it into the character and I wasn't saying too much um but I suppose really I am now taking on a role that he is now he hasn't exactly got the Sarah lines because he wouldn't stand for it but it's great I mean we have a lovely relationship it's it's so nice if it happens immediately you know it took very little time I mean he's very funny he makes me laugh and he's quite loud and I like that well isn't it it's not disrespected erotic compulsion would you agree with that Liz just just

37:13 say yes just say yes yeah she does she she's mad about me so the third story in the Sarah Jane Smith series is called test of nerve and I'm sure this will come out in the facts but it was actually the first one recorded written by David bishop and I will read the blurb for you Sarah Jane Smith receives a mysterious gift with a cryptic message the London Underground will suffer and horrific terrorist attack during rush hour unless Sarah can stop those responsible as Rush Hour draws closer the terrifying reality of the threat becomes all too apparent one friend is murdered and another abducted Sarah must be willing to sacrifice everyone and everything she

37:58 holds dear to save the city this is one deadline she cannot miss the time is eight o'clock here are this morning's headlines with new age Travelers claim they were illegally evicted from a disused London Underground Station last night Sarah Jane Smith test of nerve Dear Mr s the same fate as your friend there's no signature no address remember that news item about the scuffle outside the private lab yeah there's more to bioguard than meets the eye police are releasing the man involved in a scuffle with a junior minister James Michael Carver a former Soldier and Veterans

38:43 rights campaigner will face no charges over the incident I could be jailed for what I'm about to tell you Sarah you're right something is up London's intelligence Community is on high alert someone is threatening to kill thousands even Millions to get a tune Sarah James Smith Dion Morrison you'll have to accompany me to the station Miss Smith to answer some questions of course I can give you a full statement you misunderstand we got a phone call saying you killed this young woman we're taking you in on suspicion of murder why are you doing this revenge for my employers and who are they no no that would be telling me I just like doing the Dirty Work Miss Smith I'm James Carver you must help me

39:29 test of nerve the facts and the trivia written by David Bishop it recorded the 23rd of February 2002 at the most Studios released September 2002 starring Elizabeth Slade and Jeremy James and Sadie Miller and once again directed by Gary Russell and Music and Sound is designed by David Darlington this was the last script to be commissioned and yet the first one to be recorded in fact it was commissioned written and recorded in exactly a month in exactly a month the character of Sam Jones was originally written and recorded but needed to be changed when it was considered it was just too much baggage being brought forward for the Doctor Who book range Roy Skelton who plays a major role in production was one of the original voices of the Daleks and Gary liked the character of Harris so much he had him

40:14 written into the first story and The Last Story excellent so when I was listening to this recently Philip I certainly got a sense of the time that this came out because this is dealing with a terrorist attack which obviously in London they weren't well they they weren't common but they weren't unknown but the whole world in 2002 was still reeling from the events of 9 11. so it really struck me as interesting and I mean we we did speak to David Bishop about that and what his thought process was behind writing such a story would it be sort of the the heaviest hardest

41:00 hitting Story I mean the Dow connection was pretty heavy too but this is heavy in a different way because it's sort of more world encompassing this is certainly the action-packed version of Sarah Jane Smith so the first story was the mystery in the English Village which they do so well even the second one was still a secluded house English house so they they did the secluded Village they did the secluded house but this is the all-out action adventure which I'm not sure doctor whoever really did so in some ways this is the probably the biggest departure from what Sarah Jane would have done um it has got a huge Cliffhanger as well but this is really the format that I think really works so well this is the one that everyone listened to and thought this is the way we want to go

41:45 and later on when we discuss series two we'll see that this is actually the model they used for series two so this this first series each of the five different Adventures are experimenting and trying very different things um I think all of them work really well and part of the way I love this series so much is because every story changes its feel but this I think is actually the one that became the most popular the one that was most successful so David Bishop is the writer of the third story and we started off by asking him how he came to write for Sarah Jane Smith yeah I've been I've been looking back at my archives trying to piece it back together and the earliest node I can find is from November 2001 and even then I think rumors have been circulated in a big finish we're planning to do some

42:31 Sarah Jane Smith Standalone audios the sladen was signed out for it and they were potentially looking for writers and I know Gary Russell is going to be in charge of uh what proved to be the first of two seasons so I reached out to Gary who I knew socially and and uh and through sort of mutual acquaintance um and said well you know if you are going through Sarah Jane Smith I would love to write for Sarah J my favorite companion of all time um so if there's any chance whatsoever please consider me and uh Tumbleweed passed by for a while because I'm sure every every writer of of who related items at that point had probably been queuing up to talk to Gary about this and then he got back in touch mid-november 2001 and uh he had been

43:19 talking with Liz they had some ideas about what they wanted to do what they didn't want it to do uh they didn't want it to be like sort of canine company which I know is you know a camera classic but uh is not what Liz wanted to do with the stories at all was the impression I was getting from Kerry and lizard actually recorded I guess a four round of a podcast effectively where she talked about what would have happened to Sarah Jade after you know she left the doctor what her life would be like how she would be working as a journalist and those sorts of things and sort of where the character might have gone so anybody who was interested in writing for the Sarah Jane audios was given sent this tape that lizard recorded talking about uh the character and how it could have evolved and a few notes would Gary

44:05 about what they wanted to do and invited to pitch write a story pitch for what you wanted to do and it needed to be signed off by Gary and it needed to be signed off by Liz so I don't know how many people pitched for for the gig it was going to be five episodes an hour long age so it was different from the big finish releases of the time when they were all 25 minutes replicating the TV format generally four episodes so I pitched the story that became test of nerve I wrote that quite quickly my pitch for that since it's Gary and then waited and then Gary got back in touch uh after Christmas I think it was towards the start of January 2002 and said uh Liz has read these I've read these and and the two of us there are three we

44:51 particularly like we want to take those three definitely these three forward and we're having other conversations with other people but mine was one of the stories that uh both Liz and Gary wanted to develop further so the story that became test of nerve I think my working title was going underground which is not a great working title so it's a story although it ties into what happens in a test of nerve is far better I'm terrible at titles almost all of my stories have their titles changed and it actually stemmed from I think there were some very loose ideas potential ideas for stories that being supplied by Gary that you could develop something from this some sort of springboards for people to pitch ideas for and one was about I think it was about sort of a threat to the London Underground or to shoot to

45:39 Transport Systems and years before virgin books who who published the the new adventures and the Doctor Who novelizations before that as target books had been talking about launching their own series of uh sort of Espionage high octane Thrillers and they were looking for writers to write for that so I came up with a pitch for them and did a lot of research into terrorist incidents and how it would operate in London if there was terrorist incident and this is all long before 9 11 and everything else where terrorism became much more of an international thing obviously in the UK you've had terrorists have been blowing up parts of the UK for many years for one thing and another troubles in Ireland and things like that so I've done a lot of research

46:24 into this and then the Virgin idea for these uh sort of techno Thrillers never came about so that material all just sat in a corner waiting for me to ever come back to it and then this Sarah Jane opportunity came up and I thought was that perfectly chimes with these ideas and this research I've done previously so I fused the two together wrote my story pitch and sent it into Gary and as I say he came back to me in January and said okay this could be a go or however uh Liz's availability means that we're going to be recording this in four weeks time can you write at least two drafts of your script in the next two to three weeks and I was like yes absolutely um now at this point I just started writing for big finish I was writing

47:09 they did some uh audio dramas based on Judge Dread another 2080 characters from the comic book and I had worked on the comic in the past so I was writing judged red audio dramas for big finish which in fact John Ainsworth was one of the producers working on that particular line at the time but I think I only had one or possibly two under my belt and I was still had a lot to learn about how to write good Audio Drama so uh Gary wrote to me and said in mid January said would you like to write your story I'm going to rename it this test of nerve and I went there to much better total well done Gary and there are certain elements of the story of the original plot line that Liz was less enthusiastic about would I be happy to change them in order to get the job and write the script and

47:55 I was like absolutely yes of course uh you know anything to make Liz Leighton happy as far as I'm concerned the fourth story in the series is called Ghost Town slightly different to the rest of the stories in some ways but I'll read a blurb Sarah and Josh set off for a well-deserved break in a remote Romanian Village hidden deep in the Carpathian Mountains they're staying with Sarah's old friend Yolanda benstead a retired journalist an ex-pat who lives in an eerie mansion with no one but her mysterious manservant for company by chance Sarah has arrived at an appropriate time the village has become the setting for a top secret International Peace conference Sarah is awoken in the Night by a terrifying

48:41 Apparition is it a ghost or just a figment of Her Imagination what is that unbearable noise and will the others believe her story but Miss Smith is not the only one who's had a fright conference delegates are being terrified too literally scared to death is there something curious about the old house or something deadly about the whole village it's down to Sarah and Josh to piece together the mystery that surrounds this Ghost Town on November the 22nd 2001 the research

49:26 experiments conclusive have managed to create the perfect pitch to induce complete sensory breakdown foreign like to wish you a safe and happy stay in our humble Village and may the forces of Oppression hatred and warmongering be forever banished faith in Project CIA faltering I'm virtually a prisoner here when I agree to this I never realized what it would be like I haven't received any money and I'm never allowed to leave the laboratory hello who is it oh did someone called [Music]

50:13 get away [Music] can you hear me are you all right the room went ice cold now is this terrible noise what are you saying I think I've just seen a ghost [Music] Ghost Town the facts and the trivia written by Rupert light recorded 23rd of February 2002 at motor Studios and released October 2002. starring Elizabeth sladen and Jeremy James Sadie Miller isn't in this story because of the bus stop and what happened in the previous episode she has the episode off

50:59 directed by Gary Russell music and sound design by David Darlington this is the only big Finnish script written by Rupert light though he does act in one of the excellus trilogy plays he's the only writer on the audio series to go on to run for the television series he wrote the gift and the Lost in Time and Elizabeth staden's real life husband Brian Miller is acting in this play as I said before I think that the five stories in this whole series are very different ghost town is probably the one that takes the biggest left turn out of out of the five of them suddenly we leave in behind we go into this little Romanian Romanian Romanian to someone you yes yes Romanian there you go a bit of Romania um so we're into this different world of

51:45 ghosts and horror and so it has a very different feel because more of a ghost story and also because a lot of the other stories have been Sarah Jane Smith becoming slightly more paranoid all the time this one is gives us a break from that because she's left England behind it also once again gives Jeremy James and her a much better opportunity to work together um just because it's the two of them with that without the Sadie character there but I just for me I just love it having Brian Miller in the cast and the opportunity for both Elizabeth Sloane to work with her husband um I guess it's a bit sad that Sadie Miller's not there and it would have been the whole tree of the family it's a bit disappointing for that reason yeah what did you think about it no I thought Brian Miller did an excellent job as he always does in every Doctor Who he's appeared in of any description he's

52:30 always been great whales did we see Brian in Doctor Who uh we saw him in deep breath and we saw him in snake dance that's right they're the two stories and he did the voices in resurrection and revelation of the Daleks is he is he darling voices in those two things yeah he's in Revelation too I'm sure okay but I had forgotten those ones but I mean he's he's a great performance he gives in snake dance and also it's a good it's a good scene with Peter Capaldi oh yeah yeah for sure I think he's the Supreme Dalek in Resurrection I need to have another listen to that yeah I think he is but anyway um yeah this was this was really different this is

53:17 I really enjoyed this this is my kind of story uh very creepy and it was I thought it was resolved really well although I did feel like it's a story that's been done before but you know it doesn't matter it was done well so I still enjoyed it um the other actor that struck me a little that Robert jezek plays I I'm sure he plays two characters in this one character he's playing a heavily accented character and in the other he's he's playing some kind of American ambassador which is obviously his normal voice which kind of threw me because Robert desack has such a distinct voice you could tell it was the same guy playing both parts normally if you put on different accents the actors can sort of Disguise their voice but his

54:02 voice can't be disguised did you pick up on that I I think so I mean to me it's always rubbisher I think yeah and you know we've never had enough furbyshire um but yeah it's still a good performance I uh I guess I picked up on the the fact it was the same voice but it was Mark Donovan and I'm just well as I say it wasn't distracting it was that so I I didn't you know I didn't really notice I could be completely wrong I could be um Mark Donovan playing the other character but the voices sounded the boat sounded like Robert jesic but it to me so I could be wrong I have to go back and listen to it again as should everybody yes it's an excellent story this the scenes where Sarah Jane is being frightened by the the ghostly uh appearances is uh really really

54:49 sensationally done really good for audio yeah and just so elected yeah absolutely absolutely as was mentioned earlier unfortunately Sadie couldn't join us for this retrospective but we did speak to Sadie briefly about her time on the Sarah Jane Smith series when we spoke to her a couple of years back so we're going to show you some of that archive footage right now how did you come to be involved with big finish originally because your first Productions were with Sarah Jane Smith how did that all come about I think they obviously approached mum first and then she signed on for it and then there was going to be this character Natalie um and my mum said oh well you know why

55:34 did why don't we have Sadie try and try and do that so um I think it was mum really that signed me on for that um which was great you know to get to do something like that with her as well you know rather than just um being on the sidelines watching her do it to actually get to work with her as well was really special um but I think if mum hadn't have said that it was okay I think they probably wouldn't have a big finish wouldn't have wanted me to do it I think it was tons of mum really how old were you then because you wouldn't have been too fairly young still yeah I can't remember actually I think I was maybe in my last year of high school possibly like 17 18 possibly I think um I can't quite remember what it was was

56:19 it 2002 2002 and 2006 2002 okay so 2002 about yeah about 17 and then 2006 I guess um a few years older than that so young youngish I guess yeah how do you think had you thought about going into acting in that stage was that what you were thinking about yeah so um I went to University after I finished high school and then I went to drama school afterwards and my mum died whilst I was at drama school um and I almost got expelled because I was she obviously was very unwell and she didn't want to tell anyone so I would leave to go and see her you know and I actually um stepped out of one of the Productions that we were doing of comedy of errors and said you know I've got a family emergency I can't do this and my principal at the time

57:05 um who's actually Michael craze's brother so uh Peter praised so Doctor Who connections all over the place throughout my throughout my life um you know said to me what what you know what's going on because you're going to lose your place here um and then obviously my mum died and everyone knew what was what was really happening um and after that I I kind of stepped away from it so um being able to do this big finish now has been really nice for me as well to kind of get to go back into it because I um I loved it but I just felt I couldn't keep doing it after mum died it was a very weird period And I didn't want to access that emotional part of me really I needed to close it off for self-preservation so I just couldn't keep going with it really

57:52 so with the Sarah Jane Smith so the Sarah Jane Smith audios um was it is that what sort of pulled her back out of retirement or had she started doing some other acting work before then or people just came to get it back I think she was doing bits and Bobs but I don't think she'd maybe played Sarah Jane for a while before um before they they came out again um and then it wasn't long after that the 2006 was that she then got school reunion so it kind of all dovetailed nicely for her I think um Natalie Redfern the character that you played so she was in a wheelchair I must admit I didn't realize you were that young because she sounds old um quite mature um or how did you go if you was the word

58:37 Philip mature's the word um how did you go about preparing for the role I mean did you and you you know did the director help you much were you working with your mother how did you prepare for all that um I guess you just sort of approach it like you approach um any role so the director is Gary Russell I think and he's always been um very supportive very like Nick Briggs really that they let you have um the moment to do Your Own Thing feel it out for yourself and then they kind of guide you through it rather than impressing upon you how they want you to do it um but I think it's like because any character you find that connection where um you and the character kind of cross over um and find the part of you that lives in them so that you can tell their story

59:22 um but I must admit I haven't listened to them for such a long time I I don't even know if I've ever listened to them I must I must um must do that really I've got a copy of them at my my dad's house I'll have to dig them out and have a listen well I've been listed the last couple of weeks and they really are top qualities like a really great series um yeah I just yeah they're nothing it's an interesting where they came from because you can see this there's a touch of when your mother did there's a spin-off canine company she did so it's got It's got a bit of a feel for that but it's actually going much more into conspiracy theories and Intrigue which is a slightly different direction where it would go later with the Sarah Jane Smith Adventures um but yeah they're great stories and they're quite exciting and it's you know her on the run and you know you're

1:00:08 you're the aiding her and abetting her from the phones and things so yeah worth listening to if you listen to them um once again I mean they're used to buy some pretty big Doctor Who names like Terence Diggs burialits we're writing them did you have any idea about who the writers were at that stage or just you just got the scripts and did them I I mean I I definitely did know who they were and had their appreciation for the gravitas though um of their of their background and I think that's only increased really um in understanding how much they changed the course of Doctor Who and um how important they were to their story as a whole of not just for Sarah but also for the doctor that they're writing for at the time and editing for

1:00:54 and um what a privilege really it's such a shame that all these people aren't here anymore you know just um oh sad really isn't it it just seems that there's this huge shelf now of just so many people connected to the program who have all passed away so do you think the audience that your mother did was part of the influence in terms of um getting back on the TV show do you think they play the role or um I I personally wouldn't have thought so I mean I think that when Russell starts writing his Doctor Who that he had a clear idea of where he wanted to go and we did a documentary recently for one of the DVD releases I can't remember which which one it is um and there's an interview on it with Phil Collinson who said that he and

1:01:40 Russell had only wanted mum for the school reunion episode it wasn't sort of approaching any of the other companions so I guess they must have already wanted her and thought of her for that free um these big Finnish audios but I guess um anything that gets you back into that public Consciousness um can't help you know really um in kind of seeing and exploring where the character might go next well it's interesting when big finish wanted to do this spin-off companion series the first person they went to a meeting was Sarah J Smith and another TV show wanted you you know wanted to bring in the old companion the first one they go to 17 Smith um she the the role really is the Pinnacle companion and I think you know if anyone ever talks about you know what what does a doctor's companion look like

1:02:28 um it's always Sarah Jane's the first point of call mirror signal maneuver is the fifth Story in the series and it is written by Peter angelides here is the blurb a bio Warfare scandal from the 1940s takes Sarah to a remote island in the Indian Ocean she pursues the scoop with a fellow journalist from her former company Planet 3. but why won't she contact her friends back in the UK the more she investigates the less Sarah recognizes that she is the story Josh and Natalie discover that Sarah has been searching for pursuers in the rear view mirror for so long that she hasn't noticed who's now in the driving seat a long way from home and far from safe will Sarah see the dangers in her

1:03:15 present and the enemies from her past before it's too late goodbye Miss Winters [Music] and this time Sarah Jane Smith you'll be finished [Music] Sarah Jane Smith mirror signal maneuver info you're requested from the public records office interesting stuff not even a small tip either my small tip is mirror signal maneuver as you drive away hi it's Natalie I really need to talk to you then stuff we should talk about and

1:04:00 and you hold it out of me isn't going to help oh oh yeah there's um there's someone from from planet three we're looking for you she's been asking after you since you went to Romania you have worked hard to locate me and you have been lucky Miss Smith that's all Sarah you still haven't phoned well you know that so I suppose you must know how worried you're making me Sarah where are you well we do seem to have a lot in common Wendy so what do you think not now I've been spotted what look around the boat casually as though you've dropped something now see the man who's trying not to look at us at the other end of the boat um Tall World dress bloke bit overdressed for this heat must be European he's been following me since Monday Sarah where are you get in touch

1:04:50 come with me to the car Sarah now or I'll leave without you we have to get off these islands [Music] that would be too much of a coincidence then our paranoid little world we don't like coincidences do we Miss Smith a pleasure to meet you once again [Music] mirror signal maneuver the facts of the trivia written by Peter angelides recorded the 26th of February 2002 at the mod Studios released in November 2002 starring Elizabeth sladen Jeremy

1:05:35 James and Sadie Miller directed by Gary Russell who's gonna sound designer David Darlington Patricia may not have been prizes who are royal as Hilda Winters who first appeared in the 1974-story robot canines alluded to in the script for the first time as electronic equipment and this had two covers designed for this release one with hild on the front and one without to keep the secrets until it was revealed at the climax of test of nerve so a trip they still continue to do to this day so we haven't yet spoken about the return of Hilda Winters and what a this this really excited me because it was it was bringing something different from the classic series something that something that we hadn't seen too often we'd seen the dialects

1:06:21 and Cybermen and all the the usuals but a villain that only appeared in one store in the classic series we hadn't seen that too much before from Big finish so I thought that was really good and she's got such a Patricia Maynard's got such a great voice for audio too so it worked really really well I like the international scale of this story uh being being set in India um some some really great voice acting there which is uh Toby Longworth in particular does a does a really uh has some good some good roles in in this one and um yeah a really nice finale that wraps everything up nicely at the end yeah I fully agree it's actually once

1:07:08 again very action-packed so I must admit I enjoy the action um you're right I'm not sure that big Fitness has ever brought back a villain

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