0:00 This German guy is Patrick Niel, and he's a legend in the World Cup Trading Championships. We're talking about the oldest, [music] most famous trading competition on Earth. >> In the beginning, I wanted to trade the whole day and wanted to have 20, 40, 50 trades. >> And Patrick didn't just win it once [music] with a streak of luck. He literally dominated. Six years in a row in the leaderboards, 12 times on [music] the podium, numbers that most traders won't hit in a lifetime. >> You're still there in the leaderboard. >> This year, I make 300% [music] and in the championship, I have market profile and volume-based for the directions. >> Here's the part that nobody expects. This man was a bookbinder. He ran his family company working 16-hour [music] days till 2018, when he sold everything to trade full-time. His family laughed
0:45 at him. His friend called it gambling. [music] One year later, he was on the World Cup leaderboards. >> One hour in the morning is enough. [music] So, I wait for the right setup and then make my one or two trades, and the day is over. >> Today, I'm sitting down with him to break down exactly how he did it, the strategy, the worst trade of his life, and what actually separates a world champion from the 99% who blow up. Welcome again to World Class Edge. This is Patrick Niel. Hi, Patrick. Welcome back to World Class Edge. >> Hi, Andrea. Nice to be here. >> Nice to be here again. And I wanted to start this podcast. We've done multiple interviews through the years. We've done the first one probably was 2023 or 2024. Um and then we did another one, and then
1:30 we did one with Reese, and and you started becoming from from a from a trader in Reutlingen, Germany, into this international uh recognized trader and very famous trader. How how does it feel now? Is it any different? >> Yeah, it's really crazy. When when we met us the first time, I was Yeah, I was in Reutlingen. Nobody knows me, and it was really calm, but now I'm traveling around the world. It's >> [laughter] >> It's crazy amazing. Were you Were you planning this? Like it was part of the plan? >> Not at all, yeah. >> Right. >> I only I only wanted to show my friends and my parents that I can trade. That was the reason I I started. >> That's crazy. >> And yeah, it was the time when you come the first time it it goes up and
2:16 >> Mhm. >> Yeah, changed. >> Are you liking this so far? Being a a a teacher trading influencer? >> [laughter] >> I'm not really sure. Now I I like it, but it's sometimes I think it's well, it's a a little bit much, yeah. >> Yes, of course. It's a lot of work. >> Yeah, but I I like traveling and so it's okay. >> Nice, yeah. I I >> my wife and my kids they say something else. >> Yeah, they don't like it so much as you. Right. Because every time I see you, you also every time you're increasingly more tan in your face. You're increasingly darker. So yeah, cuz it it's like this is the thing I like about you as a trader that you you just You can trade literally anywhere. You trade from your phone. You have a very simple approach at the end of the day.
3:04 >> Yes. >> And and and you can manage to trade like as of now you're still in the world championship, right? How is the You you're currently trading in the I think the the annual Forex trading cup, right? >> always trade the annuals, yeah. >> And the last two uh 2026 2025 you're still there in the leaderboard. >> This year is really good, yeah. >> How do you do it? >> It's This year I have much luck because I am always on the screen when the markets are good for me. >> Mhm. >> Last year it was not all not so. But um it's it's good. The best thing if is for me if I I'm on my my office and then the next day I can trade with my telephone. That's okay. >> Mhm. >> And so I can trade when I'm traveling.
3:50 That's perfect. >> But yeah, cuz you have this very laid-back approach to trading. It's not, you know, necessarily full-time trading all the time. You're very relaxed with your trading, yes? >> Yeah. >> Yes. >> That's true, yeah. It's >> You >> Yeah. >> The 1 hour in the morning is enough. >> Yeah, right. >> so you can analyze the day and put your trades and >> Mhm. >> Yeah, the day is over. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think that's also part of what makes you a successful swing trader because it's >> Yeah, in in the beginning I wanted to trade the whole day and wanted to have like a scalper my 20, 40, 50 trades. But, wow, it's it's much work, and >> Mhm. >> and I saw it's better for me if I wait
4:35 for the right setup and then make my one or two trades, and >> Mhm. >> Yeah. >> How was it at the beginning? When you tried scalping and stuff with Tom and Serge? >> Boy, it's always >> Yeah, right. >> This, yeah. And uh it was hard. As a for me, I was the whole day under pressure, and yeah and so I decided to make less, and >> Mhm. >> the results get better. Right. But, it was interesting when I started with Tom and Serge and saw how how a scalper works and a uh what is Tom? The middle thing of all. And yeah, it was a amazing experience. >> Mhm. But, you don't like scalping at all. >> No. Not at all.
5:20 >> Right. >> It's Also, I'm not a very good scalper. I I don't see all things, and it's too too much work for me. >> Mhm. >> And I'm too slow with my decisions. >> Mhm. >> The when I'm when I when I trade, I have always 1, 2, 3 minutes to decide, and that's easy for me. But, decide decide in 1 second, mhm, it's too hard for me. >> Mhm. And with swing trading, how do you how do you take your decisions? How do you, let's say, walk us through a little bit of the the process that you do when you're in front of a chart? >> When I [clears throat] when I'm in my office and on the normal screens, I have uh the market profile uh volume base for the directions.
6:07 >> Mhm. >> And >> So, for example, you want to see, I don't know, value areas going up or >> up down uh then I draw my my zones support and resistance. You can say what you want. And then I go a little bit deeper and deeper and draw my PBDs. >> Mhm. >> And if they match match to the market profile and all it all comes together, then I I put my trades. >> So, you take your zones with the market profile, right? And the overall direction. And support or support and resistance. And then you wait for a PBD as your, let's say, entry pattern. >> Yes. >> Is that correct? >> That's my favorite, yeah. >> Right. And >> to come combine both and if they they
6:53 are together, then it's for me good. >> Mhm. >> Then I have two decisions. Yeah. >> And is it uh mostly which time frames you use this? >> I love 15 minutes. >> Mhm. >> That's That's perfect for me, yeah. >> I look to 4 hours to for the big picture. >> Uh-huh. >> And uh yeah, I trade in the 15 minute charts. >> And for those who maybe do not know, what's the what's the PBD? Could you explain it briefly? >> It's totally simple method. You wait for a big for push. And after the push, there comes most times a range. >> Yeah. >> And you wait till till you go out of the range to follow the trend or a counter
7:41 it and and so you go into the market. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> And so with a P, you what's your favorite type of setup? >> When you have a P, normal you you wait for to to follow the trend. But I I love the the counter trades, and I wait till it goes down. >> Mhm. >> That's I I love it, yeah. >> Yeah. >> So for this decision, you have a a clear take profit, and you can make the stop clear. That's better for me, yeah. >> You work more with a high win rate or high risk to reward ratio? Which one? >> depends on the World Cup Championship. I I preferred a high win rate. >> Mhm. >> Because you have more risk, and so it's
8:26 better you have not so many losses in >> Mhm. >> it after [clears throat] each other. And on my private, I love more high win rate. >> High risk to reward ratio. >> We risk rewards, yeah. >> Yeah. >> Because it's you can earn more money with more risk risk rewards, yeah. >> Mhm. Yeah, so you would prefer doing more risk to reward. >> Yes. >> In general. >> For sure, yeah. >> Yeah. >> But in the World Cup, I I often end my trades in the evening because I don't want overnight risk and so on. >> Yeah. >> So it's you have smaller trades. >> Mhm. And you're mostly an oil trader. Is that correct? >> I was mostly an oil trader. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> What changed?
9:12 >> The war. >> Right. >> Uh since >> How has it changed? >> I was here when the war began. And it's all all changed, and I I trade >> Like the price action changed, or >> The re >> Like the the oil market changed in your opinion? How it moves? >> My my trading, I I have the positions 4 hours till 5 days. And to this time you you don't know hey peace or not peace or the it was so crazy the move the moves were coming and and then I said okay I stop trading oil and trade more ducks. >> Ducks. >> And it was really good. Yeah. I won that yeah. >> Right. >> But I I think now I will start oil
9:58 trading and and I don't >> It's calming down. >> Yeah. It's lots of I like the silent markets and Yeah. And it's now I hope it's better. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah it was crazy. >> And I I had a big loss when the the war begins because I didn't expect it and went short at Friday and at Monday it was a expensive weekend. >> A very expensive weekend. >> [laughter] >> Not partying though in the weekend just just a a short in you in in oil right? >> Yeah. It was not so big position but >> In the championship or in your personal >> championship yeah. >> Right. >> It was hard to to come back. >> Yeah right.
10:43 How much was the gap? >> Uh in in dollar or >> In oils yeah yeah I don't know in points whatever. >> I don't know exactly 700 900 points it was really >> Really big. Awful. >> And at Monday I I wonder what's happened and till till I go out it was another 100 points it was so fast. >> Yeah. >> But it's okay. >> So now you more trading let's say the ducks. >> Yeah. >> Right. How is how is it different? Do you apply the strategy differently based on the market or is it same pattern? >> It's the same pattern yeah. But in in oil it's a it doesn't fake so much. >> Mhm. >> It it's clearer the signals in oil are >> Mhm. >> for me better yeah.
11:29 >> Right. >> But this year I make all right because Yeah, I I don't know 300% in in the championship and Yeah and Yeah, it was good. >> Yeah. >> Good decision, yeah. >> And cuz people see, you know, the the performances you make in the trading cup and of course it's really big performance, right? It's like 200%, 300%, blah blah blah. Is that Let's say cuz cuz I think people maybe not you know, then they expect that they you can make that every single year in a in a in a personal account, you know? >> [snorts] >> The great >> the approach to risk is different, right? >> Yeah, it's totally different. I have in my private accounts, I think 0.2% risk per per trade and in the
12:15 championship also two, three, four, 5%. Uh five not so really, but two 3% per >> And how much drawdown are you comfortable taking in the championship? >> 20 30%. >> Mhm. >> But it was more this year with the oil trade. >> Mhm. >> It was I must look, but I think more 50% drawdown this year. >> Yeah. >> But it's yeah, it's that could happen, yeah. >> Yeah, yeah, especially cuz cuz you're trying to optimize to win. Not to >> The position was not not big, but if you are you lost 800 points, each position position gets big. >> Mhm. Yeah. And how do you manage it now in let's say your whole life? How much percentage
13:01 of your time you dedicate to trading? >> It's less as I have three four hours a day. >> Three four hours a day. >> Yeah. >> Oh, still. >> Oh. >> Still at some time. >> Perhaps two three hours a day, yeah. It depends, yeah. >> Right. >> When I am traveling, only one hour. When I am at home, three four hours. >> So in one year there's three 365 days. How many of these days you trade? >> 150 >> 150, yeah? >> Yeah. >> You wouldn't say you're a full-time trader. It's more part-time trading. >> At the moment, yes. Yeah. Otherwise, I trade every day because sure when I traveling, I always trade, but yeah.
13:48 But when >> But I think it's good. You know, it's like it's it's not necessarily that to be a successful trader, you have to trade a lot. You know, and this is or something a lot of people think they have to trade all the time every day in front of the chart. It's not true. >> Having with my trading style, I see one two days in front if if there are come signals. And then I have I needn't to trade when I know it's nothing for me. So, I don't have to sit in front of the screen the screens. >> Yeah, I think >> Sure, I can I can search other markets. >> Yeah. >> If I don't if I find nothing in in ducks, I can't take oil, gold, gas, something else. >> [clears throat] >> But I don't do it. >> Yeah. >> At the moment.
14:33 >> Yeah, because I think it's what I like about, you know, I think it's it's inspiring of you as a trader that I think our viewers can appreciate as well is the fact that, you know, you don't need to spend all that time in front of your charts to be successful. You can also you don't have to, let's say, force your your trading style into, you know, hyper scalping 8 hours a day. I mean, you can find a a way more relaxed way to trade, a little more chill, more swing trading, more more calm cuz everyone wants the dopamine, you know, wants the dopamine of trading fast, blah blah blah. [snorts] >> Yeah. >> But I think you're a great example for for new for new traders because of this and even just with, you know, even when you're traveling, you tell me sometimes you even trade for your phone because the strategy is so simple. Right? So, it's like it doesn't there's no one way of doing
15:20 trading. Like you you can open your mind and and trade however you want, and I think it's beautiful. I think it's uh >> Yes, I enjoyed it, yeah. Sure, it's not only the to trade I it's not really true when I say I trade with my telephone because I have the zones in my mind. >> Yeah. >> From from the another >> Yeah. >> But it's possible, yeah. >> Yeah. And how >> [clears throat] >> let's say how important is it uh in your experience to when you trade, let's say, not having your life depending on your trading. Or maybe you have another source of income, or you have some capital, some savings, and you know, you don't have
16:06 all in you know, in trading. You think it's >> When I started trading, I had the luck that I I was business owner in front and sold my company. So, I have much I I didn't have to trade for my life, and that's that was good. >> Mhm. >> And now it's a good feeling too. Sometimes I'm trading, gain money, sometimes I make other things. And I have so much other projects. I love it, yeah. >> Mhm. Yeah, I think it's good because also you don't care too much about the trading. I think when you when it's all of your life and you just trade every single day, blah blah blah, it it's very hard on your psychology, in my opinion.
16:52 Like having multiple things helps you also distract, you know, when you're when you're you know, in a losing streak or something. >> And it's I I had it myself, and when I get uh the last time father uh it was the first time to get father when when I was a trader. >> Mhm. >> It's changed all. I I couldn't trade like like the the years before. I had fear. I I was nervous when I get losses. But I don't know why. And the same I have a a friend good friend in in Dubai. It's He lives near your house. >> Mhm. >> And he said the same. >> Nico, yeah. >> Yeah. When he gets father, he all changed. >> Mhm. >> And he he didn't know why.
17:38 >> How would he change? For you? >> Yeah, he said he I get a pistol angstlich uh >> Uh anxious? >> Ang ang >> Like with with anxiety, with pressure? >> and uh and trades different. >> Uh-huh. >> And he didn't know why. Also There was no no need, nothing. But it changed a little bit. When you when [clears throat] you have found something, I don't know the word. >> What was the word? >> Verantwortung >> Yeah, your responsibility. >> Uh yeah. >> When when this change, uh that's >> Yeah. So you you feel like you risk less now? >> Yes, yes. >> Yeah. You're more conservative. >> Yes, you will chill more. >> Yeah, definitely. >> Yeah. >> Definitely. How was the championships
18:24 the last few years? Did it change? How was the competition now? >> It changed really, yeah. When I began, there was always the same names and it they the the whole year the same names. And after the years, there come the the lucky punch mans. Uh yeah, they make 100% at one day, but 3 days later they away. >> Mhm. >> And that changed. There's more visibility of the competition and more people are trying to to win. >> Mhm. >> And you have to to have more percentage to be on the top. >> Yeah. Yeah, yeah. You're still winning, so. >> Not not not most most most time to
19:11 second or third third place, but >> Mhm. >> this year it looks good, yeah. >> Right. What was your in the in the last in the last two or three years, what was your worst trade and your best trade? >> The best trade I really I don't know because I they are not so big my trades. >> Yeah. >> So, yeah. But, the worst trade was in the was the oil trade this year when >> Mhm. >> It was well was in and I was here when the the trade be began the trade the war begins. >> Yes, we were here together. >> Ah, sure, yeah. >> Yeah, it's crazy. >> [laughter] >> This was the day? Yeah. >> Ah, you had a trade open. >> Yeah. >> Crazy. >> I didn't expect it, yeah, really not. >> And so, how did you move from oil to
19:58 DAX? Was it hard? >> No, it was it was okay. I always trade DAX and oil, okay, but when I compare I was much better in oil than in DAX, so >> Mhm. >> I thought it so it's it's harder. But, this year all was okay. >> How is the difference in your with the action with the daily action? How did you adapt? >> I am slower in in oil. Normally, the Yes, the way from um the daily range is $2, $3 in in oil and I can really see if it's cheap or expensive before the war. And in the DAX it can go for thousands of points. >> Mhm. >> And it's more volatile.
20:44 >> And that's nothing for me or that was nothing for me. >> Mhm. >> After the war or the during the war it was easy. Always when when Trump said Trump said, "Hey, we have freedom." then you can wait and Yes, make the opposite, yeah. >> Yeah. And do you still just volume profile and candlesticks right? You don't use footprints, you don't use books, order books, depth of markets. You don't >> No, no. It's then I get nervous and change my decisions as as a Sometimes you know, when I am in the office I I speak with Serge and and question him, "Hey, what do you think? Shall I wait some minutes or shall it's okay to go into the trade?" But that's all. For me
21:30 it's I don't use it. >> Mhm. You just for timing maybe the entry sometimes. >> Yeah. >> With with Serge. >> Yes. The the entry timings, yeah. >> Yeah. >> But so often we are not in the same room so >> Yeah. >> I can't question him often. >> Right. How's it changed now? Cuz before you were all in in Germany, now we're moving all to Cyprus. What's going on? >> That's It's was a really nice decision, yeah. It's the weather is better, all is better. And yeah. The mindset is the totally different between Germany and and Cyprus. >> Yeah, right. >> Yeah. >> It's chillier. >> More of much more chillier, yeah. >> Right. And you still all trade in the trading floor uh in uh in the trading
22:15 floor we see in Larnaca, is it, right? >> Yes. When I'm here I'm not so often there. I I live a little bit outside and travel a lot, but yeah, when I there I be I am there sure, yeah. I am I'm trading there, [clears throat] yeah. >> And you guys still trade together like in the in the whole uh fund slash certificate thing? Or not much anymore? >> No, it it goes a little bit out of It's it's not so deep. >> Mhm. Okay, so you know you're more independent. Each one trades their own now. >> Yes. >> Right. But you still work together as a team as before or now it's more >> No, that's that's the same, yeah. But Tom and Serge we we there's more
23:00 education, so we have not so much time and not always to the same >> Yeah. And yeah, so you you just recorded a masterclass for for World Class Edge. >> Yes. >> What what can people expect to see there? What are you going to teach and show? >> It's only the the structure from the PBD setups. >> Mhm. >> It's It's good for the beginners to to see when when they can trade and when not and No, it's it's I think it's it's only >> Yeah. >> Nice. Nice. We can't wait to see the masterclass. I think people will love it. It's 100% for free for this time. So, I think people will really love it. >> Yes. And say like I also tell some trades from the championship.
23:46 Because when I [clears throat] search the trades, I saw I really trade PBCs. >> Yeah. [laughter] >> Yeah. And yeah, they I explain something to for with the trades. >> Nice. So, they can basically learn some of your trades, how you do them, what you think behind them. Nice. Well, thank you for for providing us this value in World Class Edge again. >> You're welcome. >> And we hope to see you next time. One more championship under the belt or two more championships. >> I hope so, yeah. >> [laughter] >> And see you next time. Thank you, Patrick.
