Roy Suryo Cs Sangat Kuat❗Penyidik Ragu Bertindak❗Ft. Aryanto Sutadi | Ruang Konsensus

0:00 I saw that when he issued the investigative report, there were 12 reported cases. Yes Well, even when it was announced, the 12 reports weren't read out . Whatever the court decides, that is the reality of justice in Indonesia that is upheld by the judge. H. Sir, you see now a cultural figure, a doctor, a professor, all of them seem to confirm what they said . Even though in my opinion they are not right, what is it? But many people took sides in yesterday's declaration. [Music]

0:53 Hi hi Indonesian minion consensus room audience wherever you are. Asalamualaikum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. I am Budius Maruf Piliang, the eldest son of Mulyono, not the son of a Sahara desert camel. Today we will try to update because it is said that this week the reported parties will be questioned by the Metro Jaya Regional Police. And last week we were warmed up by the analysis from a number of legal people. Even the reporting witness who has been questioned said that this week, Thursday or Friday, the suspect in the fake diploma and defamation case will be announced, which has been at the

1:51 top of Google Trends for the past 2-3 months. Well, I'm here with my resource person, Retired Police Inspector General Aryanto Sutadi, expert advisor to the Chief of Police. We will get the latest update. Is it true that all of them will become suspects, detained or not detained or not even suspects yet? Well, we will discuss with Mr. Haranto. Good morning, Mr. Aryanto. Good morning, Mr. Budi. Yes sir. Let's just get straight to it, sir. 12 people, Sir I, who got the leak and their names are already in the public domain. Well, according to procedure, perhaps they will be summoned this week, sir.

2:38 Maybe it's random, maybe. Yes, the 12 people will be summoned as defendants in the case of defamation of Mr. Jokowi. If I'm not mistaken, there were four reports, sir. Well, but Sir, Roy Suryo and his friends' side still asked the investigators to postpone their summons because they had already submitted a special case title letter to repeat it again. Because in the special case title yesterday, they said the investigators did not show Mr. Jokowi's original diploma. So, what was Mr. Rianto's response to their request and is it true that everyone will be checked this week ? Yes, this is my response from Mr. Royo Suryo CS.

3:25 Hehe. When they submit their lawsuit or report, they do it in a way that makes them feel that they are the most correct, and I can see that they feel that they are the most correct. That's right. so that he feels he has the freedom to express his opinion. But what we are facing is a country of law, there are rules, right? But they still don't want to know that the rules of the Kuhab are like this. If someone files a complaint, they must first use a report (LP) which uses strong initial evidence and then submit it so that it can become an LP. But they never accused Mr. Jokowi of using a

4:12 fake diploma, but only made accusations based on his research which cannot be contested, he said, that this must be acknowledged as true, so I have the right to make that accusation and then to prove it, just show the diploma, in my opinion, his thinking is not normal, like walking around thinking like that is not normal in our country of law, right? Because if we accuse someone of committing a crime, we have to prove it by showing the initial evidence that exists. For example, if someone is accused of using a fake diploma, they should first find the diploma that is suspected to be fake

4:58 . Then what technique does he use to compare with others. If that's true, he thinks it's fake. He then reported it to the police. That's what happens, the theory that generally happens is like that. But this is not what happened . they accused. Anyway, I think it's fake. If you want to prove it, please show it, right? That's not in the general pages that happen, but they feel they are right. So far, the case has been ongoing, right? He reported it to the Headquarters 2 years ago, but they said it wasn't progressing. Then yesterday when I used Dumas, which was around December, it

5:43 didn't work either. What did he say? He said, "I was not served." In fact, if we look at the existing legal process, it was not served because it did not show sufficient initial evidence so that investigators did not show that there was a crime. That's why it was stopped then. Okay, that's it. It was for a case where he felt he had rights but was then ignored. That's how much they understand. Well, then responding to the report at Metro, he became the reported party at Metro. The one who reported Mr. Jokowi was the first to report that he was defamed, right? Haha. Reporting that he was defamed is in the form of a report,

6:28 right? The Metro Police then investigated that during the initial investigation. While this is still under investigation, we are stopping the investigation and not continuing. Yes Automatically, this diameter investigation can run because of what? If what Mr Joko reported was defamatory, defamation by accusing him of a fake diploma could work if the diploma turned out to be genuine, right? Well, because the decision or results of this new investigation state that there was no crime, that means this is genuine. Only then did the partner continue. That's the case that happened like that. So the investigation process means that the Metro Police's step in raising the status to investigation

7:14 is correct, right, Sir? That is in accordance with the existing SOP. Why did they ask for the case title to be repeated again as a strategy to delay the investigation? I said that they were either pretending not to know, but pretending to know, but it's bad that they are stubborn, forcing their truth . I also don't know how he got to that point in his way of thinking. He said to this ice cream bar, "Wow, it's Mr. Jokowi's turn to report straight away, right?" In fact, as I explained earlier, that's what happens in the legal process . Secondly, he doesn't want people to think that he rarely hates. In fact, all of Indonesia, but those who

8:01 don't hate it, don't hate Mr. Jokowi, you know. Ask if someone insults like that, is it included in the criminal elements that constitute hate speech? He will die for it. No, that's criminalization, right? That's how it is. So, that's why yesterday when it was processed with an investigation and went up to the level of an inquiry, he protested, "I don't accept it." No, isn't that funny, sir? A reporter seeking justice reported to the police and then asked for his case to be processed, but then received no response because there was no evidence. But then he was reported back there and he was named a suspect. He protested and said what should he do? What should I do? Hold a case title first, right? And then yesterday it said that the special title

8:48 that was yesterday at the Criminal Investigation Department, eh, has been served by the police, okay, ask for the special title to be served like that, right? During the implementation of the special title, I told them that this special title is a good opportunity for you to present valid evidence. What you have not been served with so far is that you do not have any proof of that. He said yes, yes, it turns out I have a special title to join you, sir. Hmm. Join in there, you know. I was what I was hoping for at that time. Hehe. He did not bring any research evidence that said Mr. Jokowo's diploma was fake compared to the three he said or this one and that he didn't bring. What I brought were only these stories, sir, my results are like this, like what was conveyed

9:35 in the media, right? that means it doesn't show any new evidence. That's why the results of the special title by the Criminal Investigation Department were originally going to be announced, but now I don't understand why they haven't been announced. I'm sure it didn't need to be announced at that time. Hmm. Well, they were expecting that, they've been waiting and now they're asking for something to be repeated again. It's not repeated, yes, this is repeated again and this is where you make a case title first and then proceed to investigation, right like that. That's how we deal with people like that, sir, in my opinion. Well, this seems to mean that the police are the ones who are not being firm, sir. The investigators. Yes Or above him, the investigator, perhaps, let's say the Regional Police Chief. The Chief of Police.

10:22 Yes How am I supposed to say that? It's not me, but I'm afraid that the investigators will be said to be afraid of something, which will definitely happen because the investigation is slow. In my opinion, yes, it was previously examined for 1 month by Mr. Eskrim to prove that the diploma was genuine, it turned out to be genuine, right, it was continued with the Metro Police investigation for 1 month and then yesterday it was upgraded to an investigation and during the investigation, they had examined how many, Mr. 49 people, heeh, seven expert witnesses, it was already complete, the evidence was all there, so it was upgraded to an investigation. My imagination is that if the investigation was

11:09 1 month, then the investigation would not have to be faster, it should have been, before, there were already these examinations, there were only the difference in the investigation stage, there was no header, pro age, that's all, right, so logically, if the investigation took 1 month, by examining expert witnesses, the evidence was already there, even though it hadn't been told yet, right, then at this investigation stage, it only took time to copy and paste the results of the investigation. Given a letterhead, re-sign, then what is the evidence used for the confiscation letter, the time should be less than 1 month. That's my calculation. But it seems that until now, even when I went to Jogja to check, I

11:54 used a breakthrough to make it faster. Hehe. Hey. And what they said was n't right, wow, that's not fair, how come he checked here and there and was denied like that, right? In fact, the meter program was designed to speed up efficiency, because many of the witnesses there had already been protests. Well, unfortunately, in my opinion, the program is also not that fast. So until now, they have been constantly trumpeting this with unreasonable demands, which has given the impression to the public that the police are hesitant or something. Yes Ee, that means according to Mr. Arianto this week there will be no surprises from the Regional Police that they will be

12:42 appointed. Some suspects have been named and some have been detained. Mr. Aranto did not see any procedures leading up to that. If we look at whether there are any suspects being named or not, I can't be sure because this is difficult to do, and it doesn't match my expectations. In my imagination, this investigation will take 1 month, if it increases, it will be less than 1 month, that's what I thought, right? And then, when I saw yesterday, it was already 1 week, this is just an examination in Jogja, right? And until now, there are no suspects at all out of the 12 reported parties, heeh. I saw that in the 12 reported parties, before, when he carried out the investigation report, there were 12

13:28 reported parties, yes, well, before, one was announced, right, no, not read out, the 12, then there was the conviction that there were 12 report cards because their own lawyers read them, there were 12, well, there were people who were angry, there were people, why did I become a suspect, angry, protesting, and so on, that's normal in an investigation process, Mr. Itopi, what I criticized here is the delay in determining who the suspect is, it seems that from my perspective, it was very clear from the previous investigation, yes, the suspect who could be a suspect is definitely Ro, then who is Rismon, Rismon, then Dr. E then Fadil is EG Sujana. Why is my EG Sujana not like that? He will pull out and pull Kang Gabu.

14:16 Well, maybe this can be considered and calculated. But if these four people are all vulgar, Sir, convey the news. Ah, I agree on this, sir. The public might also have the same assessment as Mr. Arianto. Is pollution getting better? It's already very vulgar. Not only do they remain convinced that Mr. Jokowi's diploma is fake. Ee, in fact, on many occasions they actually belittle and even make fun of the police, you know, sir. Yes This is courage like this, we have never found anyone who has been reported to the police and is already under investigation. In fact, they seem to be opposing each other. It's as if this is how it is, Mr. Aryanto.

15:01 The public believes that the police no longer have any authority in their eyes. I just regret this, sir. The public can already guess, sir. Even all the expert witnesses, Mr. Marin, when he raised the case from investigation to investigation, he had already examined seven expert witnesses, Sir. H. What kind of expert witnesses are linguists, formologists, experts? Press Council. Then I forgot the seven experts again. That means I have convinced the experts that there is sufficient evidence, so that's why it has gone to the investigation stage. For me, even without an expert, hate speech is what will definitely appear. If there were many insults, only Roi said that every time he appeared, he would insult and insult and insult and insult and insult and insult and

15:48 insult again and again. That's what I think is a criminal act, sir. If he had only insulted me once, maybe he could have forgiven me. But during this process, for 2 months, I was insulted every day. This should be recorded, right? That will later be used as evidence to the new judge so he knows how many times he insulted him, and when. Gu, well, for the hate test, Sir, these four things are hate speeches to make you hate Mr. Jokowi, all of them are like that, Sir. So it meets the requirements. That's right in my opinion. But why then, even now, to determine from the investigation, why hasn't he been named a suspect? Why not, I don't know what Metro's considerations are, but hopefully, this can be done quickly in a short time. Well then,

16:33 Sir, regarding the 12 reported persons, Sir. The reported person is not necessarily a suspect, sir. Oh, because the reported party was previously reported by the reporter that the perpetrator was this or that, it could be the reported party, sir. Hehe. But at that time, when it was reported, the initial evidence that was submitted had not been examined as an expert witness and so on. Well, now that he has been questioned by expert witnesses, oh yes, it is indeed true that the reported party deserves to be suspected as a potential suspect. But later, Sir, in this investigation, the convincing ones will be sorted out, Sir. Reported from the 12. What article did A violate? What kind of offender? What article did B violate? Or this A violates article A B C D. Oh, this only violates

17:20 this article. Oh, the one who violated this, oh, maybe there was n't enough evidence so he was n't made a suspect. It could be, sir. But behind that, there are also people who may not be reported but will later become suspects, sir. New suspect. Because of what? From these track records, this is the proof of a digital footprint. So when is BO1, sir? Wow, if you ask about video one, I think it will take a long time because the thing called raising an investigation or determining a suspect is still right now, but I hope to push for the program so it doesn't take too long because this is, I hope it will be in early August or at the end of this week, sir, I hope it will be fast, so there's no need to be afraid that the files won't be able to support him

18:07 or not, Yes, but the investigator's obligation is to complete the files until they reach the prosecutor so that the prosecutor is accepted and that's it, that's the end of the job, that's all . But how come even now, even the senior Mr. Arianto still can't predict it, sir? In fact, from the evidence side, everything is clear from the witness's perspective. In fact, the last time Mr. Jokowi was questioned in Jogja, Mr. Jokowi's original S1 diploma was confiscated and he was detained. So is a high school diploma. This means that it is very concrete, it is concrete, right? Well, then, during the inspection at PMJ ee this week, we were confronted with the parties who were suspected of deliberately defaming the public with

18:54 hate speech and incitement. That's right, Mr. Aryanto. Well, but I saw that Mr. Aryanto, who is my senior, is also a former investigator, right? It seems as if Mr. Haryanto's younger brothers, Mr. Aryanto's juniors in the investigation at the Metro Police investigators, have the impression of being afraid, worried or unsure or waiting for orders from their superiors first? If my interpretation is clear, there still seems to be doubt. There seems to be doubt. There seems to be doubt. and perhaps there is a concern that what he has prepared in his file will later be rejected by the prosecutor or not rejected by the judge. That's the doubt I see until now. Well, if it's a measure, yes, sir, if it's

19:40 my measure as an investigator, yesterday the investigation was already 1 month in Pares Krim, then another 1 month of investigation was added in that program. For this kind of case , sir, why? The evidence is all there, why is it collected, the expert witnesses have all been examined, so that's the measure, yes, if the investigators were running normally, there was no doubt or indeed it was not designed for a long time, it should have been finished, then why is there still a per, well, that's what I can't answer until now, it's just enough for me, the police nowadays often face not only this case, you know, but the image out there that was conveyed by the people behind what I used to say there is no invincible hand, right, heeh,

20:26 this is indeed the police are being made like that and our country is also being treated like that, the longer the police process this, the more they have the stage, they have time to create chaos in this country, that's why investigators, besides now, have to work hard and quickly, also think that if this takes longer, it will be more detrimental to our country. Indeed, this case of fake diploma slander is not purely a legal case. Because this has a very strong political content. Well, the problem is like this, Mr. Haryanto. What we have been worried about all this time is that Mr. Jokowi's sympathizers are holding back, sir. I'm worried that they will also surround the Metro Police Headquarters later, Sir, to

21:13 demand justice. Yes Because it seems like they have been silent all this time . These investigators are only afraid of these slanderous groups. Well, if the patience of our friends or the masses runs out, it could be that the Metro Police will be surrounded by the masses for days, Sir. because the investigators are not sure whether to determine whether this suspect is pro-justice or not, it seems as if it depends on the orders of the commander above him. The public thinks so, sir. Yes, the public thinks so. The public thinks so. Because of this, the evidence is more than enough, there are more than enough witnesses, there are more than enough expert witnesses, the ones suspected to be genuine are already in the hands of

22:00 investigators. Yes. Yes. Mr. J's original diploma has been obtained by investigators. So what else makes the investigators at Polda Metro Jaya not dare to determine who out of the 12 people are, whether all 12 are suspects or only some of them, and so on, at least there is certainty. Well, if for example the police at the Metro Police level as the nation's capital are not firm, Sir, this is dangerous, Sir. Yes That's why I can't be sure what the cause was. Why is it that until now it hasn't happened quickly? There are doubts, there are fears. Now I see that this is the only possibility that exists, why is it that this hasn't happened quickly ?

22:45 Hehe. That is the investigator's doubt in determining that this is the case, because previously there was a Constitutional Court decision, Hm. That's why there's such a commotion in Mesos. Hehe. that's why it doesn't mean it doesn't mean division or chaos unless it's already been made public. In my personal opinion, the hate speech they have been conveying has been causing division. The public knows that the division is not only in Meos, you know. Now, in social problems, what are the accelerations of inner feelings in society where each person hates each other and one day chaos will occur like that of Mr. Percangan, even now, social sparks are already happening now. This is probably what has caused investigators to be

23:31 hesitant to prove it. Even though this has been closed with the expert witness's statement. H , all those who have been referred to have confirmed that this has entered the investigation stage. But yes, because of the understanding of the Constitutional Court's decision, perhaps this is what adds to the doubts. Maybe this is the only one if I don't want Suudon to be ordered by his superiors or something like that. I, the Constitutional Court's decision was indeed a dispute and a commotion on social media, sir. This isn't a social media commotion. Yes It's already real in the field, right? Yes, this is an interpretation, right? My interpretation may differ from the investigator. But the proof isn't just on social media, sir. Their statements in the ee podcast or in the news when

24:17 they demonstrated were clear. Not only that, no, no, no, no, that's why I suggest that I'm haunted by the Constitutional Court's decision that conflicts on social media are not criminal matters, so when facing something like that, I only suggest that investigators don't need to worry, be afraid that the results of the minutes will not be successful, because if the judge interprets it, the MK's envoy will be dismissed, right, Sir, this must be encouraged, Sir, this is not a good president, Pakanto. For example, if the mother is used as the basis for this, she cannot be punished because this commotion

25:04 occurred on social media. Yes Later, Sir, if people want to insult the president and then cause a commotion on social media, they are free to do so, Sir. Not demanding the possibility of Mr. Prabowo as president will also be slandered in all sorts of ways on social media, right? Well, now the problem is that every incident, especially the ironic ones, the tragedies, happen in the field, actually on the streets, they demonstrate, issuing narratives, their demonstrations mean issuing narratives, sir. Then they filmed their shoot and then uploaded it to social media. The period that is considered as the legal object on social media should be the one that is in the field,

25:50 I think. That's my opinion too, is it true that later the judges will be so sloppy that the fuss is only about the digital footprint, the digital footprint is a recording of what is in the field. Well, that's how it is . That's what I always push to the investigators. There's no need to hesitate like this. So that's how it is. Hopefully this is it, sir, that's what I hope for. Hopefully the jirah riders are hesitant, yeah. So Mr. Reo is still pessimistic, right? I'm not sure that this week will be this far, if I look at the steps, especially yesterday I heard the prediction was still far away. Wow, I think it would be too far if this was allowed to continue, it would be a shame for the police.

26:35 This means there will be no suspect determination this week. I can't guarantee it. I can't guarantee it. Can't guarantee it. Because in my calculations, once the investigation was launched, I would have dared to announce the suspects who were definitely there. That's why yesterday when I said, "Wow, how dare you say that a normal investigator's standards, sir, are enough. No need for an investigator. The general public can interpret who among those in the line-up is worthy of being a suspect. Well, now, because I'm being intimidated, I don't want to be a suspect, why not, no, no, no, suspect. The public will judge me like this, sir. The threats or arguments of Abraham Samad, the arguments

27:21 delivered by Roy Surio in many places, in the media, on television, make investigators afraid. I, after all, investigators have been sworn in, sir. They have integrity, they have authority. How come a police investigator at the Metro Jaya Police, in particular, is so worried about the threats and arguments delivered by Abam Samad. For example, I will fight to the last drop of blood. That's what I thought. Right? Yes. This is strange, sir. H. Yes, indeed, I can't comment on this. Yes. I publicly said that this is an investigator. I can't say that, yes. Because at least Mr. Aryanto, as a senior, is also furious. I'm just comparing it to the size of the investigation.

28:06 If I were the investigator, if I were the educator, it would have been months ago, sir. I'm already a suspect, it's P21, this is P21 now. If I'm right, I've handled it before, yes, in my experience, this was a minor case, that's the comparison. Hey, I once raided a gambling operation, when it was Mr. Nurfaisi's criminal investigation. Hey. Raided a roulette gambling den in Glodok. Yes. We arrested 91 people. Hey. Once we arrested them, we invited investigators from the Police, 50 from the police station. We borrowed the police, we worked overtime. I didn't sleep for 2 days and 2 nights , sir. I investigated when I was the Chief of the Cooperatives Sub-Department, not the executor, but managing the investigation.

28:53 On Friday, I was arrested, and on Sunday, all the files for 91 were completed, sir. Hm. The following week, all the files were submitted to the prosecutor. Yes. That, Sir? Hmm. Because working according to I use tactics, procedures and tactics, Sir. Yes, using tactics. I do all the procedures, I cut corners, for example, usually when the file is submitted, it is examined for 14 days, just now, yes, to avoid that, I have coordinated with the prosecutor, Sir, this is a real case, it was gambling, it was easy at that time, well, it's the same with this case, this case is a real case, if our interpretation is the same, hate speech is actually no different from the previous one. That's why I can measure it by

29:39 comparing it with the tactics I used before with the current one. In my opinion, it was too long, so if the current investigation takes up to a month, it's not s and this is not normal, according to Mr. Rianto, it's too long, it's just like that, no, in my opinion, because it's been pushed, it's still like that, yes, I think it means that it has been given kama belief, there are two invisible hands in this case, Mr. Harant, the first is invisible, the invisible head in macro terms. He, is this really a design or is this actually a political goal, right? damaging and destroying Mr. Jokowi's good name. The next invisible hand is that there are

30:26 powerful people in the National Police, especially in the Jakarta Metropolitan Police, who are deliberately prolonging their situation, leading to continued riots. What we're worried about isn't that, sir. What we're worried about is something that ca n't be contained, sir. Because this is truly intolerable to the public. If, for example, Jokowi volunteers suddenly gathered and besieged the Jakarta Metropolitan Police for days, that wouldn't be a bad sight to see. What would the international community say, sir? Yes. For that reason, I can't comment, sir, on Indonesia. But I think the public can read for themselves, judge for themselves, about conditions like this. If I previously only said this, this

31:12 case isn't purely criminal. This is a political case. Who? What? Why political? This case was dragged out by those invisible people to sow discord. We are the ones who have the potential to be sown discord. The nation , sir, is easily sown discord. If there is already potential within it, That conflict. Well, the potential already exists between those who are pro and anti- Jokowi. This person who was stirring up trouble just stirs things up and doesn't care what happens. He contributes here and there to create discord. That's all I could say before. But if I were to point out someone now, I can't point out the person who did that. Especially if you said earlier that there were

31:57 high-ranking police officers who were taking the lead for a long time. I don't dare comment on that, but that's the risk if we don't quickly do something about it, file a case, that's what will happen. It could happen. So, these same accusations are the same, many very sensitive cases that have been handled by the police, sir. For example, the KM50 case, right? That's very sensitive. Then there's the [ __ ] case, which is very sensitive. But because the leadership, meaning the national leadership, firmly ordered a quick, transparent resolution, everything moved quickly. Well, uh, we suspect that there might not be any. Firmness, there was also no order from the national leadership to order

32:43 the Chief of Police to resolve this issue immediately . Well, this could be linked, sir. Because the fact is, something that should have been resolved, right? So it's convoluted. Right. What's the end result? It becomes a national drama. And I don't reject that opinion, sir. Representing all the people, right? But it's certainly predictable that it could happen if this or that happens. Why? If a conflict is left unaddressed, it will certainly escalate . Yes, it will escalate, right? In fact, reducing this conflict is actually simple. Quickly resolve this in court, it will be resolved. Don't show it,

33:30 don't show it, it will be resolved. No, this or that will be resolved in court as long as the file is immediately submitted to court. Whatever the court decides, that's the reality of justice in Indonesia, upheld by that judge. Hm. Like that. But so far, criminalization hasn't been silenced , we don't have justice, we're suppressing it, right? Until now, they haven't even reached court, and they've been saying that, sir, and they've had the opportunity to be on stage, and they've been saying that. This is actually a challenge for the police that must be resolved quickly. Well, we can actually

34:27 relate this to why it's taking so long? Why aren't the police being firm? If I'm not mistaken, last week or last Saturday, Mr. Jokowi himself finally issued a statement, sir. And it's been a topic of discussion until today, until this morning. What Mr. Jokowi said is that I suspect this is a major agenda carried out by a prominent figure , sir. So, what does that mean? What we're witnessing and waiting for from investigators who seem hesitant, worried, and afraid of what Mr. Jokowi said. Actually, this isn't a legal issue. What is this? A major political agenda related to 2029. And the person who said that wasn't just anyone, Mr. Jokowi. It's impossible for Mr. Jokowi to say that without valid

35:14 and measurable information, of course. Yes, he didn't mention who the prominent figure was. So, according to Mr. Arianto, is there a common thread, sir? The investigators' fear of processing this matter legally. The process of flow is fast with the signal from Mr. Jokowi, this is actually a political case by a big figure. If I were to respond to this symptom, Mr. Jokowi, until this again, I would actually show it to the public, show it to legal observers, yes, this includes Sir, show it to the judges at the Supreme Court, yes, the prospective judges who will later process this. Yes. In fact, this shows that this commotion is not on social media.

35:59 Hm. It's clear that it has entered the commotion in society, Sir. That's right. The symptoms are now visible, if you said earlier that it has reached the battle in the field, even before it reached the field, I said this was already a commotion in social media, Sir K, because the definition of commotion, Sir, is a society that is safe, orderly, and peaceful. The criteria for a society that is not chaotic is safe, orderly, and peaceful, Sir. Now, the order may still be visible, it's still safe, there have n't been any clashes, but the peace has been disturbed, Sir. This is all. Yes, it has been disturbed. Well, this is what the judges should use later. Later, we will decide

36:47 that this commotion has spread to become hate speech that they have launched, it has already borne fruit in the field. If it's iron, where are we, for example, if we are noisy, talking about what incites, burning, that's just my example, it's like that. Well, if this is hate speech to hate Mr. Jokowi. While Mr. Jokowi has a large following and he is idolized by most of the community, but on the other hand, there are people who hate him. He. So, these conflicts are big, this is already a huge commotion in society, not only on social media, as I caught earlier, this is the evidence, in fact, now, if in the past, it was only my estimate, it could grow, now it's growing, right, it's

37:34 very possible that between figures now, it will become between figures of these parties, this is what all observers should be aware of, yes, so hopefully this is what investigators can quickly send to this and hopefully later the prosecutors who are prosecuting will also not only blindly follow the applicable law, especially the judges, don't let it happen Hopefully the judge will only be guided by the Constitutional Court's decision that this is in Mesus. I hope that the public, perhaps not too far into the trial, Sir, what is actually making the public criticize the Regional Police is their lack of courage to determine who the suspect is

38:19 because of this, Sir. Now is the era of openness, right? The public already knows in many media platforms that there is more than enough evidence, not just two pieces of evidence, there are dozens of pieces of evidence. Yes, witnesses are sufficient, right? Yes, the disputed object is actually in the hands of investigators. H. So what else is there, Sir. Yes. Well, when Mr. Jokowi stated this yesterday, I actually suspected there was a big agenda carried out by a big figure. Well, what does that mean? Oh, no wonder the

39:05 Metro Police are afraid. Well, if that's the case, there are parties out there who want CEOS, Sir. There is a horizontal conflict that occurs as if this is intentional. Well, in this case, the Metro Police actually has a Regional Police Chief, above the Regional Police Chief, there is the National Police Chief. How can you not read or wait? There was friction first, then this was firm, sir. Because if it's like that, it's the same as if it's spread everywhere, Mr. Haranto. Well, sir, you think of me as an expert advisor to the Chief of Police, what can you actually do to the Chief of Police? If this is left alone, it's

39:52 like giving fuel to the fire, and it's already spread everywhere, giving it a little fire will cause a fire, Mr. Arianto. Yes, it's true, in public I said this, behind the public I advised investigators to be quick. But to my superiors, when it comes to something, I always tend to say this, this is not a purely criminal case. Hmm. But this is a politically charged case, and this case will definitely be maintained by the person who just said it again. The longer we handle this, the police will give the wind

40:38 to the property, the chaos will occur. It's as if giving wind, sir. The police, and the police in the police, are considered unable to stem the great possibility of what will happen, right? He, because of that negligence, it doesn't Hurry up. In conflict theory, it's like this, sir. Once a conflict erupts, the first thing it should do is localize it. Huh. Well, this hasn't exploded yet. Before it erupts, it should have been neutralized in that way . That's roughly how I've been dealing with this case, sir. Yes. Imagine, what should Mr. Aryan be like? A senior person should have been able to predict that

41:25 this would proceed normally. Paketo himself was hesitant to say that they wouldn't follow procedure this Friday, but everything would be over. The P21 suspect will be announced soon, right? Whether there are suspects among the 12 people is the investigator's business, but at least there's courage . Yes, that's how it should be, and the public also does n't really care about what the judge's verdict will be, sir, because the trial will definitely be open. Right? Yes. What's making the public angry right now is that the public doesn't know, sir, what the dialogue is like in the investigation room, what's going on behind the

42:10 scenes. In court, everything open. Yes. People can see everything, they can see who has a cold, who doesn't. That's how it is. And that's the rumor they're spreading, they don't believe in the investigation. They've been like that all this time. They've always been creating a public perception that we're unfair, that we're not handling things fairly, that's what they're saying. So, to stop their echoes in the field, this should be done quickly, this process should also be somewhat judicial, sir. It should be like that, why are people defending themselves by building opinions and propaganda? Investigators shouldn't think about that, sir. Yes. Investigators are just proyustia. That's right. What was reported was

42:57 defamation, what elements, uh, incitement, hate speech. When the facts are found, the evidence is there, why listen to Roy Suryo's ramblings? That's how it is. What I mean is this, sir. I mean, investigators must be like that, sir. That's the principle . That's the principle. Basically, sometimes there are investigators who... A normal investigator who isn't political, the important thing is that I work properly. But in dealing with this case, an investigator shouldn't just think that this is a pure case but has an agenda beyond that, that's sending that spirit. That's why his principle is that this shouldn't give people the opportunity to fry their rudeness . I'm speeding this up, this is what I

43:43 haven't seen so far in the investigator's enthusiasm to expedite this resolution, you know. Is he going too far ? Yes, it's like I said earlier, I once arrested a person in 1991, and it took three days to complete the file. I even said that, sir. That's to say that providing clues is too long if you're determining the suspect. That's why I gave the example that, if I used to finish, it took three days, a week to finish. Mr. Haryanto is suspicious, maybe the investigator is no longer neutral. Maybe they've also been influenced by politics or public opinion. The investigator's reason is that the investigator is too careful, the reason is that they have to be too careful, but with that caution, they don't think about whether

44:30 the risk is greater, the excesses, right? That's why Mr. Ro prefers his diction. investigators are very careful, yes, or certainly what is being said is more careful because it has attracted public attention that the content is careful because the investigator may also be politically affiliated which may not be compatible with Mr. Jak, it could be like that, I don't understand, I don't understand. But the point is, if asked whether investigators must be neutral, sir, must be professional, not related to political interests. Like this, sir, yes, I said that investigators must be careful, right? What is being careful? Don't let it be misled, there is something that is not included, right? But in this case, there is already too much evidence, sir. So actually, he has no reason to be

45:15 too careful. First, sir, there is too much evidence, but why is he still being careful? Ah, that's why I said it's okay to be careful, worried that the evidence that should be a lot is difficult to obtain, the evidence is small. Well, this is the opposite, sir, there is a lot of evidence. Right? But why did Mr. Aryanto use the diction that the investigator was careful. The reason he gave is still the same, sir. He said that it was difficult because it was dealing with the public. But behind it, it actually meant that Royeroy and his friends were really great, Sir, they were powerless, and the investigators were made to do that. What is the success of that post-truth, Sir, the strategy to force something to be wrong, if

46:01 repeated, it becomes ingrained. Well, Sir, this is very dangerous, Mr. Arianto. When Mr. Arianto drew a conclusion, yes, the post-truth era that we are currently living in, we are experiencing. Yes, it can have a negative impact on the professional attitude of investigators in the police. One of the risks is that investigators are faced with a menu every day from morning, noon, afternoon, evening with various opinions from the people being questioned. Wow, this is dangerous, Sir. Yes, what do you think? Is it true that Mr. Aryanto sees a future trend, yes, cases like this will be feared,

46:49 will be feared by investigators to solve them? I answered this, which was only successful in my analysis. Yes. I want to answer why critics take so long? Huh, like that. Why are investigators not like I imagined? If in the past, what was the investigation 1 month plus 1 month, does this mean that this investigation will be because it is just repeating and what is it? It's still at least less than a month. He. Why is that? Why? Yes, we have already submitted the evidence, it's complete. Heeh. In fact, if I add something like this, sir. The evidence used is not enough just from before the report, sir. He. But after the report, there is a lot of supporting evidence, right? That can still be added. So the evidence is already

47:35 overloaded with overloaded evidence, and then the process is in accordance with the Criminal Procedure Code, why isn't it resolved quickly? That's certainly what was conveyed was caution. He. Because of that caution, because this is a public issue. So, of course, the spirit must be successful, something like that. Because of that caution, people who are careful and hesitant won't make a decision quickly, sir. That's what's happening now. It's possible, if I analyze why this case isn't resolved quickly like that. That's roughly what's happening, sir. Well, this is what the police chief must realize, saying the more this hesitation, the less fast, the risk will be. a will report to the police. That's what was

48:20 said earlier, that the police are now consumed by that posture. But I can't deny it, sir. That post will definitely put a lot of pressure because now the portion given by the public, by what the media is more on their portion to say things that are repeated, that is very sensitive, sir. Hey. Meanwhile, what is the voice of those who voice it from the authorities like me, yes, almost 1 in 10 of those who exist, that is what is pressuring the members in the field, that is what I think, for example, a risk that cannot be avoided, that is the current condition like that, Sir, what exists, is this a challenge or a threat, I

49:05 don't understand, this Pakanto can approach this threat to the professional attitude of the police, Sir, in handling cases. That's why, sir, if I appear like this, my aim is only to provide clarification to the public. This is what happened. Hehe. Because I am now concerned, sir. Never mind ordinary people now . Sir, you see now a cultural figure, a doctor, a professor, all of them seem to confirm what they said . Even though in my opinion they are not right, what is it? But there are many who sided with yesterday's declaration who were

49:52 taken in by that post . Well, but he helped with the postrut strategy, it was as if it was like that, Mang. Hmm. That's why the rescue now has to be done through the community that has developed that posture. The fear that many people have about posters being a threat is because this poster era is an era where a person's reasoning really needs to be strong, sir. Is not it? Yes Yes Just imagine, sir. There is a postulate in the era of posture that lies can be truth. Yes Indeed, as long as it is done continuously, without stopping, right and confirmed by many people, it

50:39 will be the truth. Well, and what do I have, ee, [ __ ] case . I take the [ __ ] case as an example. Actually, the [ __ ] case a few years ago was also in the post-rut era. At that time, the media was also very busy. But what was very interesting at that time was the firmness of the leadership. At that time, President Jokowi immediately summoned Kaplodi and visited Lukam. I order the President to resolve this issue as soon as possible in a transparent manner. Yes Immediately, the Chief of Police and the Coordinating Minister for Political, Legal and Security Affairs monitored this case because of the President's orders. Well, this case may have involved the public, and the

51:25 public is both pro and con. But there is no national leadership like Mr. Joko did when handling the [ __ ] case. Likewise, KM 50, Mr. Arianto. Yes Yes There's some truth in that, sir. Can I confirm your opinion, sir ? If I see it, yes, from my own experience, yes, seeing the post trut, it used to be very prominent when it was the time of the presidential election, right? Heeh, it can only be stopped after the election has progressed, sir. Yes, it stops by itself, right? Well, it's the same with this, if I hope this posture, sir, will continue to complain if this is allowed to continue, it won't be quickly sentenced here. Well, for [ __ ] first, sir, that's the key. At that time, I became famous on TV because I appeared on

52:11 [ __ ]. Yes I said, I said this is what happened it was like this. Haha. I said back then how stupid the police were. I said that, how could a member die and then the person being questioned was a shootout. I was the barada at that time. If a member dies, you have to make a report like this one about why they died. Hmm. Not because it was immediately announced one day straight away, oh they were shooting. Well, that's where I was then considered to be open. Well, this is where I think the key to why the poster was completed was because Mr. Jokowi ordered that it not be covered up. Don't cover it up transparently, don't cover anything up, it will eventually be revealed. That's right. That's when it can be finished. What's the meaning of what's

52:58 going on there? Is this defamation case also waiting for President Prabowo's word, sir, that this should be resolved immediately without causing a commotion, right? Do we have to wait like that for investigators to have the courage, the guts? If that exists, that would be even better. But but I should not have to wait for that if I were the investigator, the one who should be sent next week to the suspects and then the rest of it, the key if I were me to overcome that, overcome this poster-postur, yes, the investigator should immediately send it as it is, yes, I have coordinated with the prosecutor quickly so that this case will immediately reach the court, the poster will stop by itself, Sir, that's right because at least

53:45 based on ee Bang, what they have done so far, they don't come out in the media anymore, Sir. The most real examples, sir. Yes, for example, their posture was so sloppy yesterday when Roy hadn't heard that it was sitting there, I challenged him, it was like this, it turned out it had been confiscated even though at that time . So, what happened? he still said that this matter was not finished yet. That's why, sir, the opportunity to postrun is still wide open as long as there is no certainty in this case in court. That's just the key. The master of ee what ee postureut is played by Roy Suryo, he is indeed very skilled, sir, there, right?

54:32 In fact, some people also think that maybe this friend has been trained for that, right, sir? Okay, Mr. Aryanto, this is indeed quite complicated, yes, sir, because I am here, sir. To be honest, later on, behind the presumption of innocence, it will be said that I am not afraid of that. They themselves are the ones who spread the premonition of guilt with me . If we talk about the presumption of innocence, they are determined as suspects and the reported party is the presumption of guilt. Hey. If they understand the principle of the presumption of innocence, they should assume that we accept their way of thinking as researchers, right, sir? Yes The statement is that we suspect that

55:20 Mr. Jokowi's diploma is not genuine. I do n't think so, sir. It's already 1000 trillion percent. Well, that's how it is. Jokowi's diploma is fake. There are even those who say that Jokowi didn't finish his thesis and so on. At that time, the principle of presumption was innocent, sir. If we say that, it means we have already accused, judged, and sentenced someone, right, Mr. Aryat. Well, so we really do need to be firm, sir. And what is our message to the investigators? Don't wait until President Prabowo issues an order for them to be firm in completing the investigation. Don't

56:06 cover anything up. Just open everything. If indeed out of the 12 people, they really have to be suspects, then just suspect them, or even if there are more, it becomes 15, then just suspect them. If out of 12 people, it turns out that only four people, only five people are suspects, there is no problem. The public just wants to know that there are procedures in place and that the trial process will soon begin. There is certainty that it won't be like that. There is certainty. Otherwise, this drama will continue. The less certainty there is, the easier it is for them to fry and the previous posture will continue, sir. Hehe. I really regret it if this is not stopped quickly, the evidence is quite strong. I'm not making this up, my experience is that

56:52 this evidence proves that a case like this is very easy, the evidence is already there. So it's not that I'm being forced to defend Mr. Jokowi, that's not true. Hey, I just gave it because in the post-structural era, Mr. Aryanto was actually one of the victims in the post-structural era where the public saw Mr. Arianto, who was already a senior like this, being shouted at by Ahmad Kozinudin. Rosorio's teaching yesterday afternoon was extraordinary, Sir. Yes, that's how it is. Something that we have always maintained good manners in public, he will show off for reasons of freedom of expression. Yes Mr. Aryanto was cursed at, ...

57:39 And what surprises me is that the National Police institution, where Mr. Aryanto is a part, is keeping quiet. This is strange, Mr. Aryanto. But it's okay, sir. What is certain is that we are all waiting for Mr. Aryanto to see that there is a pessimistic tone that this week there will be no suspect week. Yes, that's also the latest information actually. Because we know that this week, from Monday to Friday, there will be intensive inspections. They summoned those 12 people and on Thursday there might be a case conference, after that the suspects will be named, right? It turns out that the story will not necessarily happen, Mr. Rianto, instead of hoping, let's just wait and see

58:25 what happens. I don't want to predict this and that. But what is clear is that I am the investigator, last month I already identified all the suspects, more than 10, bro. Okay, Mr. Harantul, thank you to the consensus room audience. Let's just pray that Mr. Arianto will be reactivated and that the investigators who are currently questioning the 12 people will be replaced by Mr. Aranto. Mr. Aranto said that if I were an investigator, then tomorrow everything would be fine and I would still be a suspect. Because all the evidence is not just two pieces of evidence, dozens of pieces of evidence are already available. The object of the case is Mr. Jokowi's original diploma, Mr. Jokowi's original high school diploma has been questioned by

59:10 investigators. The expert witness has been questioned, especially the reasons and it turns out that this week there is no certainty that there will be a suspect deposition, let alone P21 reaching the prosecutor's office. That's our discussion this time. Let's wait, hopefully there will be a surprise. Friday. What is the term for Friday, sir? Holy Friday. Holy Friday. Is there Holy Friday this week or not? Let's wait together. Thank you for your role. Peace be upon you and Allah be upon you. [Music]